Aren

I am making final decisions to purchase an 06 S2k. One of my concerns is the type of lap times it pulls. I hear a lot about them having a lot of over-steer. I do know they are razor sharp and hard to drive - well at least harder than my M3.

I want to know how it stacks up against an e36 M3.

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks.

mikegarrison

Stock for stock, The S2000 is about the same or a little faster. It definitely would depend on who is driving.

The M3 is easier to drive fast. The S2000 probably has more potential, mainly because it is lighter and has a better suspension system (double a-arms instead of struts). It is also more ready to just drive to the track right off the showroom floor.

One thing to consider is that some track organizations won't allow convertibles. Many accept the S2000 roll protection, but some do not.

You will learn more driving skills with the S than with the M3.

(PS. I'm a BMWCCA HPDE driving instructor.)

stitos2k

With an average driver the M3 is faster. With an exceptional s2k driver, the s2k is faster by a hair and only around a track. On the street I'd say the M3 has our number. You notice I wrote exceptional s2k driver... An exceptional M3 driver is probably average in a s2k, at least until he learns the limits and quirks of the car. There is definately a learning curve associated with the s2k, which is why so many numbnutts think its a slow car. There are tons of average s2k drivers out there who'll only drive the car to 80% of its potential, a few better than average who might eek out a 90%, but only a hand full who'll ever break the 95-100% of the cars potential. The guys who are average and try and hit that 100% usually end up posting in here about how they totalled the car and how is sucks because they don't know how to drive it. (don't take that as a flame guys, I'm not implying that everyone who has had an accident fits into that category. **it happens)

If you are curious, I only rate myself as average to slightly better than average. I probably only drive the car to within 85% of its limits, which is more than enough for me . I'm getting to old for that anyways!

So, if you want to impress people at the track or the street M3. Just at the track, S2k. Though s2k looks damn good no matter where it is! But the street light racers are going to like the M3 more. Also, if you plan to track the s2k is probably more reliable certainly less expensive to repair. I don't care what kind of car you have, if you track it things are going to break.

Aren

Yeah the M3 had some problems this last weekend at NASA HPDE in Willow Springs big track. That's probably what got my parents start talking about me getting rid of it (blessing in disguise ) I mean I have to pay for the car, but since I live with them it's their final decision.

I do plan on tracking the car. I mean i've heard so much about the s2k being this and that, but I want some real world experience. I have never been too concerned with straight line performance, though I suspect the S2k to be slightly faster with the same horsepower and higher gearing... In that case, I don't really care if it is faster in a straight line or not. I just want to have a nice potential of increasing lap times at the track.

I also finally joined NASA after going with a couple other little guys. NASA is so much more organized, really makes me want to keep going and improve on everything.

Amer

M3 is more forgivable if you make mistakes, S2000 is very tail happy which makes it very hard to tame in the corners.

QUIKAG

S2000 is a blast on the track. Lap times are driver dependent, but I would say the S2000 has the potential to run better at the track than an E36 M3 stock for stock.

IheartS2ks

Ugh... for the last time... the S2K is a DRAG RACER! not a "track" car.



sheesh.

Ks320

Correct me if I'm wrong, AP2 is a little less twitchy than the AP1 due to wider tires and different suspension geometry. That should help mitigate the "hard to drive" and "scary oversteer" (snap oversteer) a little bit

medicalstudent

I went from a 98 e36 M3 to a '02 AP1 S2000. The difference is eye-opening. BMW built much understeer into the e36 M3. Your M3 is VERY forgiving. The car is so damned good, it practically drives itself and masks your mistakes and sloppiness on the track. The S2000 is less forgiving. The handling is geared towards oversteer. However, if you learn how to drive the s2000 well, you will find out the oversteer can be mastered and tamed. The M3 on the other hand, if that car goes from understeer to rapid oversteer, the M3 becomes much more difficult to control than the S2000 itself. The S2000 is a quick car and 99.9% drivers do not fully maximize the car's potential (including myself). My instructor took his bone-stock 02 S2000 and gave me a thrilling ride as he passes up multitudes of Porsche 911 GT3 Cup Cars in the advanced classes like they're standing still. The only car he got passed up by was a Spec Miata.

Bottom line, the S2000 won't hide your mistakes that the M3 does. But then again, you'll learn how to drive better yourself rather than the car driving for you.

One more thing, the S2000 is much more fun to drive on the track than the M3 regardless of lap times

If the oversteer really bothers you that much on the track, I'll give you my secret that many people on this board do not know of or care to believe in: Mugen Coilovers.

jackk

Reading all of this reminds me of when I tried out my friend's Z3; boring, boring, boring. It is a car that does everything well as one would expect but any school teacher (no offense) could drive it. May as well have been in a Camry or something similar. The S2K is a driver's car and rewards you if you know how to drive it around 9/10ths or so. A few quirks that keep you honest and on your game is what makes me buy a car, the S2K.