S2000 vs MR2
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From: Montreal
Originally posted by Sime
Dave,
That's because the mag (probably) didn't take the car too far into Vtec or anywhere near redline. It would figure that the car was slower when not in its powerband. They probably didn't know that they could extend the engine that high.
PS. did you see my post above in relation to your MR2? I didn't see a reply from you which I thought was odd. Thanks for the info on the stereo also!
Keen to know how the R8 testing goes!
L8R,
Dave,
That's because the mag (probably) didn't take the car too far into Vtec or anywhere near redline. It would figure that the car was slower when not in its powerband. They probably didn't know that they could extend the engine that high.
PS. did you see my post above in relation to your MR2? I didn't see a reply from you which I thought was odd. Thanks for the info on the stereo also!
Keen to know how the R8 testing goes!
L8R,
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From: Montreal
Originally posted by 2kturkey
David, my comments were more directed at the North Americans than yourself. I just cannot believe it when Sev says "anyone" can get a 6.5 (0-60mph) easily. If it was that darn easy then I damn well know I could get a 7 flat without trying and I'm sure I can't.
Out of interest the RACV tested the Stook at 7.4 0-100k about a year ago and I'm sure that was exactly the sort of "off idle" you refer to.
In my case all my tests were 1/4 full tank, single driver, night temperatures around 18C - in other words, pretty much optimal conditions.
However, I may have the opportunity to prove this further as my contact with the Gtech is now back on the scene and I'm sure we can get some accurate numbers with that.
Originally posted by DavidM
btw, how do you time the runs 2kturkey?
btw, how do you time the runs 2kturkey?
Out of interest the RACV tested the Stook at 7.4 0-100k about a year ago and I'm sure that was exactly the sort of "off idle" you refer to.
In my case all my tests were 1/4 full tank, single driver, night temperatures around 18C - in other words, pretty much optimal conditions.
However, I may have the opportunity to prove this further as my contact with the Gtech is now back on the scene and I'm sure we can get some accurate numbers with that.
Yes it is that easy, just do a regular launch and shift fast, of course not everyone can shift very fast...
If you are using a handwatch like DavidM said that can easilly loose you about 1 second.
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From: Melbourne
Regarding the 'slow' time I'd go with Sev, they do (always) complain about a slipping clutch. I'm sure that these magazine people know how to hit the redline ... afterall, they manage to do it in every other car (including other VTEC Hondas).
My clutch is still very new so I can't comment, but is the S2000 clutch that weak? Does it slip that eazy?(I read about 3-4 local writeups where they complained about slipping clutch).
Sime, Your CRX was quick, but it's the 0-100km/h time that I 'disputed' - CRX is a front-wheel drive and it's hard to get those things of the line fast, no matter how much power you have. And as you recall, upto 100km/h there was not much between the CRX and MR2. After 100km/h you were a lot quicker, though, from my memery not as quick as S2000. If I'd have to categorize your old CRX, then I'd say that it was more in line with a TypeR Integra.
My clutch is still very new so I can't comment, but is the S2000 clutch that weak? Does it slip that eazy?(I read about 3-4 local writeups where they complained about slipping clutch).
Sime, Your CRX was quick, but it's the 0-100km/h time that I 'disputed' - CRX is a front-wheel drive and it's hard to get those things of the line fast, no matter how much power you have. And as you recall, upto 100km/h there was not much between the CRX and MR2. After 100km/h you were a lot quicker, though, from my memery not as quick as S2000. If I'd have to categorize your old CRX, then I'd say that it was more in line with a TypeR Integra.
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From: Montreal
Originally posted by DavidM
Regarding the 'slow' time I'd go with Sev, they do (always) complain about a slipping clutch. I'm sure that these magazine people know how to hit the redline ... afterall, they manage to do it in every other car (including other VTEC Hondas).
My clutch is still very new so I can't comment, but is the S2000 clutch that weak? Does it slip that eazy?(I read about 3-4 local writeups where they complained about slipping clutch).
Sime, Your CRX was quick, but it's the 0-100km/h time that I 'disputed' - CRX is a front-wheel drive and it's hard to get those things of the line fast, no matter how much power you have. And as you recall, upto 100km/h there was not much between the CRX and MR2. After 100km/h you were a lot quicker, though, from my memery not as quick as S2000. If I'd have to categorize your old CRX, then I'd say that it was more in line with a TypeR Integra.
Regarding the 'slow' time I'd go with Sev, they do (always) complain about a slipping clutch. I'm sure that these magazine people know how to hit the redline ... afterall, they manage to do it in every other car (including other VTEC Hondas).
My clutch is still very new so I can't comment, but is the S2000 clutch that weak? Does it slip that eazy?(I read about 3-4 local writeups where they complained about slipping clutch).
Sime, Your CRX was quick, but it's the 0-100km/h time that I 'disputed' - CRX is a front-wheel drive and it's hard to get those things of the line fast, no matter how much power you have. And as you recall, upto 100km/h there was not much between the CRX and MR2. After 100km/h you were a lot quicker, though, from my memery not as quick as S2000. If I'd have to categorize your old CRX, then I'd say that it was more in line with a TypeR Integra.
I don't think it is as much a problem of the clutch being too weak.
I feel the problem is that there is too much grip (thick rear tires, SO-2s, 50% on back wheels) and there is not enough torque to get the wheels spinning before 5000 RPM because of this exceptional grip. So what happens is, if you don't get off the clutch fast enough you will not be able to shock the rear tires into spinning and the clutch will spin, once it starts spinning it doesn't stop...
What i have done to minimize this problem is the following:
-Higher tire pressures, about 37-38 psi all around.
-Took out the spare and keep the trunk empty.
-Keep the gas in the tnk to about 1/2 or less.
With these steps you will be more easily able to light up the rears and prevent wear and tear on your drivetrain and clutch.
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From: Melbourne!
Originally posted by DavidM
--Though, I'd love to hear your report from the Gtech runs ... I'm very interested. Can you do some 'off idle' tests as well? As well as shifting at 7k revs? I'm interested in all performance aspects of the S2000, not just it's top end. Also, where would you time these runs?
Anyway, I should get some 'testing' done tomorrow against the HSV R8 - there's no trick to that one getting 6.0secs to 100km/h - you just put your foot down at idle :-) This will really tell me how fast the S2000 is.
--Though, I'd love to hear your report from the Gtech runs ... I'm very interested. Can you do some 'off idle' tests as well? As well as shifting at 7k revs? I'm interested in all performance aspects of the S2000, not just it's top end. Also, where would you time these runs?
Anyway, I should get some 'testing' done tomorrow against the HSV R8 - there's no trick to that one getting 6.0secs to 100km/h - you just put your foot down at idle :-) This will really tell me how fast the S2000 is.
I got a mail back from my contact today (I know he doesn't want his name mentioned) - he is using his Gtech at present as he has entered into the Calder Street drags on Friday night and has another comp the week after.
I think I will go along myself on Friday to check out how he goes and just to get a feel for what happens (let me know if you're interested). He has achieved 6.1 flat for 0-100k in his unmodified 'teg type R, which is pretty good in my books.
Most of my testing has been in Kilby Rd Kew but I'm loooking for a better spot.
With regard to the R8 you may find there is more to it than just flooring it if you want to get best times. In my 5.7 Firebird auto I found best times could be achieved by left footing the brake and building up to 3k revs before releasing the brake - the difficulty here of course being in maintaining traction
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From: Melbourne
hehe Sev, so in other words, what you're saying is that the S2000 clutch is not good enough for the S2000 :-) My old car (MR2) had the same clutch problem. Not only is it mid-engined and has 54% of the weight at the back, it also had a clutch that would not last long if you did a few high-rev launches. That clutch lasted 30k km and then I put in a heavy duty racing clutch - that did the trick ... no way that baby was gona slip ... that lasted 100k km :-) I'll probably do the same if/when the S2000 clutch goes.
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From: Ex-pat f/Melbourne, Au. Now in
Dave,
Well, I'd be happy if the S2000 was even quicker than my old CRX!!
I recall too that I had a lot of trouble getting the car off the line on the starts. We were virtually neck and neck up to 100kmh (you always got better starts and I had to catch you!).
But I distinctly recall that in the rolling gear starts in second gear (and third gear), as soon as Vtec hit, it obliterated the MR2 (Surprised the hell outa me too!).
You were actually the first car that I even 'ran' against, but I did get better with my launches against other cars in the end. So I was able to minimise/eliminate the advantage that rear wheel drive/4wd cars had over me at the starts. It just took some practice to get the optimal launch/slip settings.
The ITR is a very quick car but honestly, I haven't driven one or been in one. IMO, I believe that my CRX had about the same power (maybe a tad less), but was definitely much lighter, so I'd venture to say that it would have been a little quicker. Although, as the ITR had more torque, this could have helped to even things up b/w the CRX with less torque but lighter body.
As I said, if the S2000 is even quicker than my CRX, I will be a very happy camper!
By the way, thanks for the new GPL track! I'll check it out when I get home. Oh, I think I am getting my S2000 today! I opted to get the yellow with black interior.....it's too good a color to pass up! My 'vette goes back to GM on Friday.
Cheers,
Well, I'd be happy if the S2000 was even quicker than my old CRX!!
I recall too that I had a lot of trouble getting the car off the line on the starts. We were virtually neck and neck up to 100kmh (you always got better starts and I had to catch you!).
But I distinctly recall that in the rolling gear starts in second gear (and third gear), as soon as Vtec hit, it obliterated the MR2 (Surprised the hell outa me too!).
You were actually the first car that I even 'ran' against, but I did get better with my launches against other cars in the end. So I was able to minimise/eliminate the advantage that rear wheel drive/4wd cars had over me at the starts. It just took some practice to get the optimal launch/slip settings.
The ITR is a very quick car but honestly, I haven't driven one or been in one. IMO, I believe that my CRX had about the same power (maybe a tad less), but was definitely much lighter, so I'd venture to say that it would have been a little quicker. Although, as the ITR had more torque, this could have helped to even things up b/w the CRX with less torque but lighter body.
As I said, if the S2000 is even quicker than my CRX, I will be a very happy camper!
By the way, thanks for the new GPL track! I'll check it out when I get home. Oh, I think I am getting my S2000 today! I opted to get the yellow with black interior.....it's too good a color to pass up! My 'vette goes back to GM on Friday.
Cheers,
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