Wear Holes in the Top (new info)
07-19-2004, 10:12 AM
#391
Thanks, Hockey. I'm thinking I will try Goop.
On another note, does anyone think some of the soft top wear could be attributed to the elastic straps wearing out? I noticed that my elastic straps are no longer elastic at all, and don't assist the top to fold properly. I'm wondering if this is causing more stress on the material as it folds down. I went ahead and ordered one of Modifry's elastic strap kits today (here).
On another note, does anyone think some of the soft top wear could be attributed to the elastic straps wearing out? I noticed that my elastic straps are no longer elastic at all, and don't assist the top to fold properly. I'm wondering if this is causing more stress on the material as it folds down. I went ahead and ordered one of Modifry's elastic strap kits today (here).
07-19-2004, 11:03 AM
#392
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I'm just gonna buy a MY02-04 top and be finished with this. Hartopguy has them for sale for a bit over 800 bucks and with a little patience I'm sure I can install it in one weekend. I'll let you know how this goes 
07-21-2004, 08:01 AM
#393
Do any of you guys think the weak, short lived elastic straps could be causing some of these wear holes? It would make sense to me that the top could suffer additional wear if the top isn't folding properly due to worn out elastic. My elastic straps don't do anything anymore.
http://www.baustnet.com/honda/mods/topfix/index.htm
http://www.baustnet.com/honda/mods/topfix/index.htm
07-23-2004, 07:48 AM
#394
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I found two holes on my top, but they are in a totally different area. Mine look to be from the bar that is directly over the drivers seat bar. It has made 2 long scratches, but haven't quite punched through yet. I also am out of warranty by mileage, but the service manager thought they would be able to help me. He thought it looked like the bar was rubbing, and he said that is a manufacturing flaw. Next week the head of service will be back from vacation, and he will make the final judgement.
07-26-2004, 12:03 AM
#395
Gentlemen:
Again, I am a "senior member" who has had convertibles around for along time. The first one was a STUDEBAKER and it was new! Tops do not wear out and get holes from "normal wear and tear" FROM THE INSIDE. Normal wear and tear works like this. First the plastic covering on the top becomes hard and brittle. and the stitching starts to fray from the outside. The plastic coating on the top develops cracks, and the thread on the stitching begins to break from the outside. Then the cracks in the plastic coating may lead to wear through in the canvas underneath, and the stitching may come lose in some areas. Then (after maybe 10 to 15 years of neglectful use) the top may develop "holes" where the stitching is just gone, or where the canvas has worn through AFTER the plastic on the outside has first cracked. IN NO EVENT is "wear through" from the inside after only three or four years of use "normal wear and tear." Wear from the inside of a convertible top can be caused by only one thing --- a design defect involving the metal parts that raise and lower the top.
I am happy to hear that some of you are getting some help (or at least promises) as to "from the inside out" top wear out from Honda, whether in warranty or out. It scares me that Honda has been unable to come up with a simple "padding kit" fix for those of us who have no "from inside out" holes due to the fact that where we live the weather is so beastly that we rarely lower our tops. And we on this board all seem to be looking for the same thing, and that is a way to prevent this problem----as opposed to making Honda spend large sums of money over and over again replacing tops when the underlying defect goes unsolved. It all seems so stupid to me. Honda could "fess up" to the problem, put its engineers to work on it, and come up with a $5 fix in padding the metal structure. There is mention in the posts above to a class action suit. I don't like those. They are wasteful, but all too often are made necessary by a manufacturer's bull-headedness in refusal to address a problem in the most cost effective manner. And, if Honda fails to change its tune on this, it is walking right into one.
For one, I have tried to take the initiative in looking at all the photos on this board, and trying to translate the "inside out" wear I see into the need for padding on the metal spider. I have had service advisors at my dealer look at, and approve my work as valid prevention of this problem.
My warranty will expire due to time next month. Before that, I will have a "come to Jesus" talk with my dealer's service manager, with witnesses, concerning this problem. I will ask, with witnesses present, if there is anything else I can do to prevent my top from wearing (more correctly tearing) from the metal parts on the inside. I will agree to pay to have any preventative measures done by the dealer then and there. Thereafter, if my top developes wear (more correctly, tear) holes from the inside and Honda will not fix the situation, I WILL come out of retirement as a business litigation attorney and file suit over this. I won't file a class action and I won't make a dime from this. But I will set a precident, that hopefully all of you can use.
Don't make me don my "flame proof suit." I dislike lawyers more than any of you. That is why I retired very early! But what else would you suggest? We clearly have a problem in design that existed the day our cars were built, and it is tearing our tops. But for the fact that I rarely lower mine as where I live it is either too hot or cold, I'd have tears too. All I want is prevention. Flames will be disregarded, but constructive suggestions will be welcomed.
Thanks,
Rihcard
Again, I am a "senior member" who has had convertibles around for along time. The first one was a STUDEBAKER and it was new! Tops do not wear out and get holes from "normal wear and tear" FROM THE INSIDE. Normal wear and tear works like this. First the plastic covering on the top becomes hard and brittle. and the stitching starts to fray from the outside. The plastic coating on the top develops cracks, and the thread on the stitching begins to break from the outside. Then the cracks in the plastic coating may lead to wear through in the canvas underneath, and the stitching may come lose in some areas. Then (after maybe 10 to 15 years of neglectful use) the top may develop "holes" where the stitching is just gone, or where the canvas has worn through AFTER the plastic on the outside has first cracked. IN NO EVENT is "wear through" from the inside after only three or four years of use "normal wear and tear." Wear from the inside of a convertible top can be caused by only one thing --- a design defect involving the metal parts that raise and lower the top.
I am happy to hear that some of you are getting some help (or at least promises) as to "from the inside out" top wear out from Honda, whether in warranty or out. It scares me that Honda has been unable to come up with a simple "padding kit" fix for those of us who have no "from inside out" holes due to the fact that where we live the weather is so beastly that we rarely lower our tops. And we on this board all seem to be looking for the same thing, and that is a way to prevent this problem----as opposed to making Honda spend large sums of money over and over again replacing tops when the underlying defect goes unsolved. It all seems so stupid to me. Honda could "fess up" to the problem, put its engineers to work on it, and come up with a $5 fix in padding the metal structure. There is mention in the posts above to a class action suit. I don't like those. They are wasteful, but all too often are made necessary by a manufacturer's bull-headedness in refusal to address a problem in the most cost effective manner. And, if Honda fails to change its tune on this, it is walking right into one.
For one, I have tried to take the initiative in looking at all the photos on this board, and trying to translate the "inside out" wear I see into the need for padding on the metal spider. I have had service advisors at my dealer look at, and approve my work as valid prevention of this problem.
My warranty will expire due to time next month. Before that, I will have a "come to Jesus" talk with my dealer's service manager, with witnesses, concerning this problem. I will ask, with witnesses present, if there is anything else I can do to prevent my top from wearing (more correctly tearing) from the metal parts on the inside. I will agree to pay to have any preventative measures done by the dealer then and there. Thereafter, if my top developes wear (more correctly, tear) holes from the inside and Honda will not fix the situation, I WILL come out of retirement as a business litigation attorney and file suit over this. I won't file a class action and I won't make a dime from this. But I will set a precident, that hopefully all of you can use.
Don't make me don my "flame proof suit." I dislike lawyers more than any of you. That is why I retired very early! But what else would you suggest? We clearly have a problem in design that existed the day our cars were built, and it is tearing our tops. But for the fact that I rarely lower mine as where I live it is either too hot or cold, I'd have tears too. All I want is prevention. Flames will be disregarded, but constructive suggestions will be welcomed.
Thanks,
Rihcard
07-26-2004, 08:28 AM
#396
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Well, went back today to the dealership for the big boss to check out my top. He called me 30 mins later to let me know that they had ordered me a new top!!! I could hardly believe it. Even 10K out of warranty. I'll keep my fingers crossed for the rest of you.
07-26-2004, 10:29 AM
#397
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so, they are replacing it 100% covered? schweeet.....
also just as a side note, i was informed back when i had my top done that the wear is not considered 'normal'.... it's just not covered out of warranty by Hondacare b/c it's considered body/exterior which isn't covered via Hondacare anyway...
mine (and others that i've looked into) were all special consideration repairs via Honda.
also just as a side note, i was informed back when i had my top done that the wear is not considered 'normal'.... it's just not covered out of warranty by Hondacare b/c it's considered body/exterior which isn't covered via Hondacare anyway...
mine (and others that i've looked into) were all special consideration repairs via Honda.
07-26-2004, 11:49 AM
#398
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yup, 100%. I think the forgeting the oil cap incident this weekend helped my cause some too.
Yeah, mine is a good faith repair. Still I was shocked they said they would do it.
Yeah, mine is a good faith repair. Still I was shocked they said they would do it.
07-28-2004, 11:49 AM
#399
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Just got a call from the dealership, and they are doing my top on Friday. Anyone who has had this done, is there anything I should check when they are finished. He admitted this was there first top replacement ever.
07-28-2004, 03:46 PM
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RBC3 could we persuade you to post (or offer as a fax to PMers) your receipt for the top showing that they replaced it for free?
I'm 'still' waiting for the DSM to decide to show up and look at my holes to make a ruling. It's been 2 months.... My service guy is not optimistic. I've given him 1 receipt, which he thinks will help, but they wrote it up as a "seam" issue, which lessens the impact.
Dinnyin
I'm 'still' waiting for the DSM to decide to show up and look at my holes to make a ruling. It's been 2 months.... My service guy is not optimistic. I've given him 1 receipt, which he thinks will help, but they wrote it up as a "seam" issue, which lessens the impact.
Dinnyin