[QUOTE=PilotSi,Feb 27 2006, 03:17 PM] My point is, Honda could've devloped a 240hp motor without the need for the extra 1000RPMs.

 

I am not saying the S2000 does not take advantage of the 9,000RPM redline, just saying that just because it revs to the magic 9,000RPM doesn't make it fast. If it did, the RX-8 wouldn't suck so hard.

Peak torque and peak HP DO mean something. The fact that the S2000's gearing is designed to keep you in VTEC after shifting if you go past the peak HP is what saves you. If your gearing allowed you to stay in VTEC and shift at peak HP the 700RPM from 8,300 to 9,000 would do you no good. They muscle car guys have known this for years. Their gearing allows them to shift at max HP and stay in their power band. They don't rev to redline on every shift.

You of ALL people should understand how gearing affects acceleration.

 

Yeah, but then you are not using the cars max potential. That was my point.

Just for giggles, shift the S at 9k and short shift the Z06 by 1k RPM and I'll still bet on the Z06.

 

.... I disagree


you are talking only in relation with engine speed, but it is also important the axle ratio, a corvette would rev up to 7000 but if thier final gear is lower maybe it has to shift at the same time as a 9000 rpm S2000. let do an example with the S2000


the stock F20C





a F25C, stroker kit, revving only to 7000 and axle ratio 3.3







both shift a the same time, we just have to know if the extra HP is enough to compensate the lower axle ratio

Juan

 

No, that's not quite correct. It doesn't have to do with the VTEC point. It's all about how much thrust is being generated by the rear wheels before and after the shift. Where peak torque and horsepower happen in the rev range do not have any direct bearing on shift points. The acceleration in 2nd gear at 9000, even though it's past peak hp, is still greater than the acceleration in 3rd gear, both before and after VTEC. So it'd be counterproductive to shift early - you're hurting your overall acceleration.

Things are different for the muscle car guys because older domestic engines' torque tended to drop off a lot at the high end. (This isn't much true these days anymore, by the way.) For them, the acceleration at redline was actually lesser than the aceleration in the next higher gear.

 

[QUOTE=ruexp67,Feb 27 2006, 04:08 PM] I am not saying the S2000 does not take advantage of the 9,000RPM redline, just saying that just because it revs to the magic 9,000RPM doesn't make it fast.

 

lol well duh. the Z06 is substantially faster. as i said before, redline is a factor, not the direct cause of the result.

 

Now, I am beginning to think that we (specifically you and I) have been arguing semantics the whole time.

A motor that makes 240 HP but only revs to 5,000RPM fitted to the S2000 would (Assuming a similar torque curve) get the car down the 1/4mi in the same time, and at the same speed as the F20C.

There are lots of ways to make power, and high revs are one of them. However, the other ways to make power are also quite valid and would have worked just fine on an S2000.

 

Your post is 100% correct. I was just referring to the fact that the car obviously makes MUCH more power beyond the VTEC point than below it. Your response was much more technically accurate.