AEM EMS tuning notes
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,273
Likes: 7
From: tiverton
Originally Posted by wadzii,Jul 21 2009, 12:17 PM
any luck w/my maps?
over the weekend i had to pull the air pump ( a local guy wanted to buy it), so while i was in there i decided to bypass the IACV and throttle body coolant lines, just to see if it helped in the heatsoak department.
Its been a little cool since i did that so i dont have definite answers, but i can say that the car dose not heat soak nearly as bad.
my drive to work consists of 10-15mins of traffic, 20 mins of 75mph highway driving and 2 mins of 35mph cruising.
before the coolant bypass i would see around 90deg when i started my drive to work, by the time i got to the highway the temps would be around 125, once on the highway they would settle at 115-120deg. Thats an initial increase of 35 deg and sustained 30deg increase
today, the temp was 80 when i left, by the time i got on the highway they were at 95, finally settling at 100 on the highway. thats only a 15deg increase initially and 20 deg overall increase.
EDIT: Dyno is tomorrow!
over the weekend i had to pull the air pump ( a local guy wanted to buy it), so while i was in there i decided to bypass the IACV and throttle body coolant lines, just to see if it helped in the heatsoak department.
Its been a little cool since i did that so i dont have definite answers, but i can say that the car dose not heat soak nearly as bad.
my drive to work consists of 10-15mins of traffic, 20 mins of 75mph highway driving and 2 mins of 35mph cruising.
before the coolant bypass i would see around 90deg when i started my drive to work, by the time i got to the highway the temps would be around 125, once on the highway they would settle at 115-120deg. Thats an initial increase of 35 deg and sustained 30deg increase
today, the temp was 80 when i left, by the time i got on the highway they were at 95, finally settling at 100 on the highway. thats only a 15deg increase initially and 20 deg overall increase.
EDIT: Dyno is tomorrow!
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 4,894
Likes: 9
From: Tampa, FL
Originally Posted by wadzii,Jul 16 2009, 10:55 AM
I put the airbox lid on last night. I just got to work and the thing is coming off before i leave.
the car just feels alot more sluggish all around. I had to take out about 8% fuel past 5000 rpms (which tells me that its making less power). air temps might be a little lower once they settle, but the variance is HUGE. While sitting at a long stop light on Wake forest road today i saw over 160 degrees, on the highway (after about 10 mins) they came down to 118.
the MOST i have seen with the lid off is 140, and they come down ALOT faster to the 115-120 range.
the lid changed the tune quite a bit. something i really didnt expect. This could be the reason for such mixed dyno results on stock ecu'd cars.
the car just feels alot more sluggish all around. I had to take out about 8% fuel past 5000 rpms (which tells me that its making less power). air temps might be a little lower once they settle, but the variance is HUGE. While sitting at a long stop light on Wake forest road today i saw over 160 degrees, on the highway (after about 10 mins) they came down to 118.
the MOST i have seen with the lid off is 140, and they come down ALOT faster to the 115-120 range.
the lid changed the tune quite a bit. something i really didnt expect. This could be the reason for such mixed dyno results on stock ecu'd cars.
Can't argue with that sound though
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 11
From: Raleigh, NC
The dyno didn't produce the info i went down to get.. issues w/the car.
1st thing.. i didn't get to test the stock ecu, i need an extension harness so that i can swap them out with out changing wires. I ran out of time to test it at the end, I didn't do it first b/c i didn't want to move the wires around again (remember I'm using a 1050 ems.
2nd the car made awesome power after 6000 rpms, from 3 to 5500 its missing ALOT.
before you look at the graph this dyno reads LOW. a bone stock ap1 makes less than 175 on this dyno. A stock 06 si makes 170 here, so add 20-30 hp and you'll get what a typical dyno will show. The numbers here arent important, the shape of the curve is.
Ill explain....
the solid lines are with an AEM ITR 3 inch cold air intake. This is the dyno intake, it makes more than nearly everything on every car. The 4 inch piping didnt come in so no 4 inch intake test. however my car would benefit from the longest 4 inch intake that would fit in the car judging from this and a few other things we did.
the dotted lines are all stock parts tuned with the EMS.
you can see the huge dip from 4 to 5500. this is not right. other ap1's on this dyno had pretty flat torque curves from 3000 till vtec with about 105ft/lbs
I'm borrowing a few dyno graphs, i hope noone minds, lmk if you do an ill take them down.
this is what an ap1 graph should look like (disregard the numbers, look at the shape of the curve)
notice how flat the torque is from 3000 to 6000
now look at this graph... stock ap2
notice the same general shape, big dip from 3500 to 5000... same as mine
My conclusion... the car has ap2 cams.
now my question, is there anyway to easily identify the cams by looking at them?
1st thing.. i didn't get to test the stock ecu, i need an extension harness so that i can swap them out with out changing wires. I ran out of time to test it at the end, I didn't do it first b/c i didn't want to move the wires around again (remember I'm using a 1050 ems.
2nd the car made awesome power after 6000 rpms, from 3 to 5500 its missing ALOT.
before you look at the graph this dyno reads LOW. a bone stock ap1 makes less than 175 on this dyno. A stock 06 si makes 170 here, so add 20-30 hp and you'll get what a typical dyno will show. The numbers here arent important, the shape of the curve is.
Ill explain....
the solid lines are with an AEM ITR 3 inch cold air intake. This is the dyno intake, it makes more than nearly everything on every car. The 4 inch piping didnt come in so no 4 inch intake test. however my car would benefit from the longest 4 inch intake that would fit in the car judging from this and a few other things we did.
the dotted lines are all stock parts tuned with the EMS.
you can see the huge dip from 4 to 5500. this is not right. other ap1's on this dyno had pretty flat torque curves from 3000 till vtec with about 105ft/lbs
I'm borrowing a few dyno graphs, i hope noone minds, lmk if you do an ill take them down.
this is what an ap1 graph should look like (disregard the numbers, look at the shape of the curve)
notice how flat the torque is from 3000 to 6000
now look at this graph... stock ap2
notice the same general shape, big dip from 3500 to 5000... same as mine
My conclusion... the car has ap2 cams.
now my question, is there anyway to easily identify the cams by looking at them?
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 11
From: Raleigh, NC
The highest ap1 dyno on RLZ's dyno was 194, that car had an intake, toda header and an ems, that was open header.
the highest WITH an exhaust is 182
from 6000 on my car had the most power of any ap1 that has been on the dyno.
the highest WITH an exhaust is 182
from 6000 on my car had the most power of any ap1 that has been on the dyno.
Former Moderator
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 8,821
Likes: 5
From: Jacksonville, FL
Gawd...that is the Anti-Church dynopack...it reads as low as Church's dynopack reads high!
For the cams...I'd PM LostMotion. He's done a huge amount of research and testing on the cams.
For the cams...I'd PM LostMotion. He's done a huge amount of research and testing on the cams.
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 11
From: Raleigh, NC
lol yeah it is on the oppsite end of the scale from churches.
this is an OLD dynapack.. it was originally purchased brand new by eurospeed in cary nc in 2001, then sold to RLZ around 2004. I ran the dyno when it was at eurospeed, so i am very familiar with it and its reading!
RLZ's race car runs 9.1's at 169mph making around 750 on this dyno!
this is an OLD dynapack.. it was originally purchased brand new by eurospeed in cary nc in 2001, then sold to RLZ around 2004. I ran the dyno when it was at eurospeed, so i am very familiar with it and its reading!
RLZ's race car runs 9.1's at 169mph making around 750 on this dyno!
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 11
From: Raleigh, NC
i posted my map from the dyno on the aem forum in the same thread linked in the first page.
I lowered vtec since it was on the dyno, on the dyno vtec was at 5000, its at 4000 in the map i have posted.
I lowered vtec since it was on the dyno, on the dyno vtec was at 5000, its at 4000 in the map i have posted.
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 11
From: Raleigh, NC
I yanked the valve cover this morning and found the problem
so basicly the exhaust cam was advanced one tooth.
this motor has been gone through in the past obviously. the 2 dark links arent lined up on the crank or idler gear right. I verified TDC on the crank pulley and with an extension in the spark plug hole.
Its hard to say 100% if this fixed it but the car feels alot better and i had to pull about 3 deg out of the ign map at wot because it started detonating and it wants vtec back at a normal 5300 rpms
so basicly the exhaust cam was advanced one tooth.
this motor has been gone through in the past obviously. the 2 dark links arent lined up on the crank or idler gear right. I verified TDC on the crank pulley and with an extension in the spark plug hole.
Its hard to say 100% if this fixed it but the car feels alot better and i had to pull about 3 deg out of the ign map at wot because it started detonating and it wants vtec back at a normal 5300 rpms