Extreme oil consume, 5 liter every 7500km
03-08-2019, 05:39 AM
#51
You have a leak in the combustion chamber, nothing from the gaskets and o-rings you want to change will affect this.
There is not that much you can do wrong when doing a compression test, the gauge can read low though but I would like to think a experienced mechanic has quality equipment.
Did he get you a number regarding the "air leak" or just that it was good?
F20C engine should read a lot higher than most standard engines so this mechanic might have thought your numbers were normal based on inexperience.
Normally when you get low readings you squirt a small amount of oil through the spark plug hole, then do the test again.
If numbers goes higher with oil then you know the piston rings are worn out, if results are the same then it's the valves that are at fault.
There is not that much you can do wrong when doing a compression test, the gauge can read low though but I would like to think a experienced mechanic has quality equipment.
Did he get you a number regarding the "air leak" or just that it was good?
F20C engine should read a lot higher than most standard engines so this mechanic might have thought your numbers were normal based on inexperience.
Normally when you get low readings you squirt a small amount of oil through the spark plug hole, then do the test again.
If numbers goes higher with oil then you know the piston rings are worn out, if results are the same then it's the valves that are at fault.
Good news, the mechanic has used a better modern gauge today and results are 12,5 in 3 cilinders and 14 in other, so it means it´s almost new. With that gauge he can print the results, he will email me those later so I can upload here.
So, now, the issue are the gaskets?
thanks all!
03-08-2019, 11:43 AM
#53
My daily driver burns 1 quart every 1000 miles. I authored the video linked above and changed my valve stem seals at the same time (but did not film that since it was my first time doing valve stem seals). I used supertech valve stem seals and unfortunately it had zero effect on my oil burning issues.
I've measured my crankcase pressure and it was holding 14 PSI of vacuum steady last time I checked so I don't have any leaks in the crankcase. At this point I suspect that the oil is getting past the rings due to the way the AP1 bottom ends were manufactured. It would explain why almost no AP2s burn oil like this.
I've measured my crankcase pressure and it was holding 14 PSI of vacuum steady last time I checked so I don't have any leaks in the crankcase. At this point I suspect that the oil is getting past the rings due to the way the AP1 bottom ends were manufactured. It would explain why almost no AP2s burn oil like this.
03-08-2019, 11:57 AM
#54
My daily driver burns 1 quart every 1000 miles. I authored the video linked above and changed my valve stem seals at the same time (but did not film that since it was my first time doing valve stem seals). I used supertech valve stem seals and unfortunately it had zero effect on my oil burning issues.
I've measured my crankcase pressure and it was holding 14 PSI of vacuum steady last time I checked so I don't have any leaks in the crankcase. At this point I suspect that the oil is getting past the rings due to the way the AP1 bottom ends were manufactured. It would explain why almost no AP2s burn oil like this.
I've measured my crankcase pressure and it was holding 14 PSI of vacuum steady last time I checked so I don't have any leaks in the crankcase. At this point I suspect that the oil is getting past the rings due to the way the AP1 bottom ends were manufactured. It would explain why almost no AP2s burn oil like this.
So you believe were some early models that simply drink oil but are ok, or faulty in general?
03-08-2019, 12:03 PM
#55
There is a significant manufacturing difference between AP1 and AP2 with how the cylinders are bored IIRC. The manufacturing procedure used for AP1s lead to ovalized cylinders. Additionally, I believe anything under 1 quart/liter per 1000 miles is considered normal depending on driving style (I forgot where I read this).
03-08-2019, 12:12 PM
#56
1 quart is close to 1 liter.
There is a significant manufacturing difference between AP1 and AP2 with how the cylinders are bored IIRC. The manufacturing procedure used for AP1s lead to ovalized cylinders. Additionally, I believe anything under 1 quart/liter per 1000 miles is considered normal depending on driving style (I forgot where I read this).
There is a significant manufacturing difference between AP1 and AP2 with how the cylinders are bored IIRC. The manufacturing procedure used for AP1s lead to ovalized cylinders. Additionally, I believe anything under 1 quart/liter per 1000 miles is considered normal depending on driving style (I forgot where I read this).
The manual says can me “normal” 1 litre every 1000 kms on hard driving, but I do not hard drive.
Also other owners of AP1 reported almost any consume, others 2 liters every oil change at 7500 kms.
Do you mean my engine is good and just got a small issue while forging the metal parts?
Pic of the manual is here:
Controlar Consumo de Aceite de Nuestros Ss - Página 32 - S2000 - Club HondaSpirit
03-08-2019, 12:16 PM
#57
Yes, but you should follow the other threads here and make sure you have proper crankcase vacuum. You can also get an idea for what might be wrong by noticing when oil is coming out of the tailpipe. You can read up on this.
03-08-2019, 12:57 PM
#58
I look at many things from an economic point. Yeah, using oil would bother me, but it's oil and it's cheap.
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me
. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.
Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me
. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
03-08-2019, 01:05 PM
#59
I look at many things from an economic point. Yeah, using oil would bother me, but it's oil and it's cheap.
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.
Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me
. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
03-08-2019, 02:00 PM
#60
I look at many things from an economic point. Yeah, using oil would bother me, but it's oil and it's cheap.
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.
Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
Pretend a quart of oil is $10. It's half that price at WalMart, but $10 makes the math simple for me
. The S2000 isn't fussy, any 10W-30 will do.Pretend also that the "normal" oil use in this engine, in factory or repaired condition, is a quart every 2000 miles. We're consequently expected to spend $10 every 2000 miles or $5 every 1000 to replenish the engine oil. So the real additional expense here is $5 every 1000 miles. That's less than a Big Mac Meal to put the dollars into perspective. 20,000 miles? 20 x $5 is $100 in excess cost every 20,000 miles. That could be 4 or 5 years driving this car for me. Looking at repairs that cost thousands of dollars to fix a $100 expense over 5 years makes no sense to me. And at WalMart prices the extra cost is $50 over 20,000 miles.
Enjoy the car. Don't obsess over minor engine oil wastage. Run the numbers.
-- Chuck
The oil consume doesn´t bothers me, at the contrary, it give me great fun making me play mechanic opening the hood every walk and put a bit of oil, clean the engine top, etc. More or less as on the 1950´s time.
What afraids me is this being the symbtom of something deep as the engine getting broke or getting an accident out of a engine fail, per example when the valve accesories can fall into the engine etc.
I buy Motul Excess 5 liter can at 25 euros buying 4 at once, so this cost me only other 25 euros every 7500 km. oil change and gives me a lot of fun, but as I say, I would like to stop at time a deep issue if it exists as it seems so, right?
Per example, I know the catalisator can be damaged by excess of oil as on my case, and it cost a fortune!
I am buying all the pieces I readed than can do the engine losing, as the oil cap etc. Monday I will do the order
This are the pieces TO CONFIRM ( please help)
- TDC Sensors O-Ring – On quotation below
- Oil Filler Gasket –
- Oil Dip Stick(cant order orings separate) –
- TCT Gasket & Peep Hole Washer –
- Cam Idler Pulley O-Ring –
- THIS ARE THE PIECES I MUST REPLACE FIRM ( I believe), please help you pro guys
https://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuin...C106;et=2%2C8)
https://www.coxmotorparts.co.uk/hond...lve-1999-2003/ I am not sure If I must order as well the rubber pipe, or if this can be installed on the old one my engine got, do you?
https://www.coxmotorparts.co.uk/hond...er-gasket-set/
https://www.coxmotorparts.co.uk/hond...stem-seal-kit/
https://www.coxmotorparts.co.uk/hond...r-upgrade-kit/
Thanks!