[QUOTE]Originally posted by Luder94
[B]What does ECU modding accomplish?

I'd answer it as such:

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ultimate lurker
[B]Because Hondata has a couple of spare ECUs that they can already reprogram.

 

Ddddduuhhhhh!!! The obvious escapes me. However, with an addition of MSD ignition...can't even this be modded?

Although it adds to the cost of the VAFC and may put the cost of the hardware and the cost of dyno tuning to a final cost of more than the Mugen/Spoon ECUs....but still get to keep the immobilizer and fine tune for my particular engine output.

 

Hondata has been popping up off and on for a while now. It seems that timing is the big advantage of using a replacement ECU over the V-AFC. I remember many discussions about this on the old site (RIP) what seems like eons ago.

I think the bottom line was an ECU mod was pretty much worthless without the ability to control timing. Remember... this was before superchargers, turbo's, and V-AFC tuning.

BTW: How do the other ECU manufacturers defeat the immobilizer?

 

From what I found out...it's because they tune made for JDM use ECU's. JDM ECU's don't have an immobilizer on it (or the immobilizer functionality is turned off).

 

It really would be odd for Honda to create an ABSOLUTE dependency between the key and the ECU. Surely there is a way to marry or divorce the combo.

 

The issue is that the ECU's Hondata has obtained can't be reprogrammed by the dealers. Their scantools won't work - we've tried, believe me (thankfully the dealer never charged me for trying). The Mugen and Spoon stuff don't have immobilizers.

As for the other stuff, Luder, you're wrong about the ECU adapting to the VAFC. If you set the lo-hi throttle points correctly, the ECU will never know the VAFC is doing anything. I've now dyno'd several cars repeatedly with VAFCs and there have been no issues with power gains being lost over time.

The Mugen ECU also picks up power everywhere including up top. However, it tends to run too lean and with too much timing advance for our 91 octane gas. Haven't tested a Spoon ECU.

If Hondata actually develops an ECU using our own F20C units as a core (vs. converting an RSX ECU), we'll go the more traditional route which involves burning a new ROM for the ECU. A basic setup would be $400-$500, but if you spend another $300 you can get a programmer and the software and make any changes you want.

UL

 

UL,

Since Hondata (and every other company that makes a replacement ECU) knows what the inputs and outputs are to the ECU, why spend so much time trying to modify a stock one? Why not just make a complete replacement piece where you know exactly what's going on with the firmware at every step of the way? I'm sure there's a good reason, but can someone tell me why, like maybe they DON'T know all of the I/O points?

 

Because there are so many things that you don't want to, or have to modify that would take some serious development to get right.

For example, the "accelerator pump" function which adds an extra dose of enrichment on tip in. Idle speed corrections for A/C and alternator turn on. Voltage corrections, idle speed control algorithms, etc, etc.

If you've ever had a chance to try and program an AEM EMS you'll know what I mean. The AEM has every function an OEM ECU has and then some, and you have to set them all. Honda has already done a lot of the homework in getting their engines to run right. All you have to do with something like a Hondata (or similar ECU) is change the A/F ratio at whichever point you choose, change the timing wherever you choose, as well as having the option of running boost.

UL

 

Well, good luck with the project. I'm sure with some perseverance you guys will figure it all out.

And I can't wait to see what a Hondata/Toda cam/ported head/Mugen header F20C does on the dyno. I'm sure it'll be awesome.