(*) This may be your first mistake - to actually think the dealer is on your side. They're playing "good cop, bad cop" on you to divert you from the fact that they just don't want to warranty this again.

(**) I highly doubt Woodwork will reply to you. I can only assume that he is bound by his position with Honda to be careful of everything he says here. If you are waiting for him to post publicly something that is a very "delicate" situation, you have a long wait. That's not why he participates here. He is not the "Ann Landers" of Honda.

(***) Have you not seen all the posts on this forum over the last 3 or 4 years about how people "drive it like they stole it"? I'm NOT saying you do this, but this practice does exist and is not hard to believe that an owner can break a car the first week he owns it.

(****) Is it really pointless? In another current thread, there have been many examples of people being unfamiliar with this car. A few helpful hints and these people have come back to say their grinding has diminished to almost nothing. If you think there is no thought to shifting, then that's your philosophy and not necessarily everyone else's.
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This thread started out with Woodwork wanting to show this forum some interesting pictures along with some interesting data and information. Some of you have turned this thread into a broadcast of personal disappointment with Honda to near Honda bashing. This should have been done elsewhere in another thread. I can guarantee you that these sorts posts in an "informational" thread will make it such that we will see fewer and fewer contributions from the only true Honda representative we have on this forum.

 

That's awesome foolio, thanks. It helps a lot! I was going to ask even more questions but then I started browsing that site you linked from and found even more educational pictures...






Hmm.. I still have more reading to do. Anybody in the Dallas area need to do a transmission that they wouldn't mind me watching?

 

Are you talking about "doing" a transmission in a Biblical sense? I don't think I would want to watch that (or be watched for that matter).

 

[QUOTE=xviper,Sep 28 2004, 06:27 PM] This thread started out with Woodwork wanting to show this forum some interesting pictures along with some interesting data and information.

 

Hecash, you are a gentleman.
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Please understand that I was not trying "chastise" anyone for being angry or annoyed with their own situation. I would also be equally vehement in my views if it were me. I just wanted to make sure that we did not direct any of these comments at Woodwork and I hope he doesn't take these things personally.
Woodwork does not come here for this reason. He comes here on his own freewill (and out of goodwill) to extend to us some of his information and expertise. I would hate for him to feel on the defensive every time he comes here. It would be a true loss if he stopped visiting.

 

This is what automatics are for.

Most of shift lever effort comes from synchros. The price for stronger synchro action is higher shift effort and or longer throw. There is no free lunch.

Manual shift requires learning. Varies by car. Once you learn you stop thinking about it. For example. Do you think about slipping the clutch? No? Did you when you first learned? Do you shift the S2000 just like your other manual cars or trucks?

Synchros wear as a result of use. Just like clutch or brake pads.
It is possible to grind any manual box in existence with bad enough technique.


Well yes the model T is different. You don't exactly shift gears on a model T. No shift lever. You step on different pedals to tighten drive belts ("bands") on drums. You push down to engage the "clutch." Yes there is a reverse pedal, and no throttle pedal.

 

[QUOTE=hecash,Sep 28 2004, 09:06 PM] I plead guilty.

 

Anyone who needs tranny work done in the DFW area can come see me.

What I haven't seen discussed here yet is a big cause of problems in Honda trannies (universally): poor clutching. It doesn't take much grinding to destroy a Honda tranny. Personally, I think this is because they engineer for "just right" rather than over-engineers for ham-fisted slack-kneed Americans who will drive their Honda like a Ford truck. Every Honda has many of these issues; I hoped the "new" S2k tranny design would help but it has not.

Eventually, when you blow away all the "points" on the synchro ring, they mushroom and get VERY difficult to shift. Depending on the tranny design (car model) you may lose certain gears. Regardless, it's bad, as you end up saturating the oil with metal bits and then bathe all the components in that...

I have yet to see a Honda tranny where the occasional grind didn't take out the synchros, dog rings, and the gears. By the time you lose a gear, don't even bother with a rebuild- buy a new or used transmission.

This transmission is no more flawed than any other Honda transmission. You can blame Honda or blame the driver, you will still get the same end result unless you change one of those two.

 

Here's another twist to my problem with the dealer/Honda Care.

On Friday, I had some spare time and actually remembered to call Honda Care to inquire why I had to pay the labor bill. Honda Care's reply to me was that they never told the dealer that I had to pay the labor. They said that since all the parts weren't replaced the first time, that they would only cover the parts and not the labor. So the dealer passed that cost over to me and made the excuse that Honda Care said that it was "driver abuse" that caused the transmission the break only one month after having it rebuilt.

In short, the dealership lied to me.

So I then called the service manager at Bankston Honda and politely told him what Honda Care told me. He claimed that they suggested to Honda Care the first time that they replace all the gears in the transmission, but Honda Care denied that claim and said to only fix the broken gears even though the others were showing wear.

So when they tranny broke the second time within 3 weeks, Honda Care said they wouldn't pay for labor because the parts weren't replace the first time, so the dealer passed the bill to me.

How pissed off do you think I was on the phone with him? He finally agreed with me that I never should have had to pay for the labor. He's going to speak with Honda Care to see what they are going to do about it.

All I know is that I had better get my $600 back! This is the stellar service that I have come to expect from all Honda dealerships and all Honda companies whether they are directly or indirectly related to Honda in the case of the Honda Care warranty provider.

If I actually had money and time, I'd file a lawsuit against Bankston Honda and Honda Care.

 

This is pretty disturbing....I've skipped gears all my life. With the S, I'd redline 123 to get my VTEC fill, the skip to 6th. I will agree that if this is not done with a deft touch and knowledge of what your driveline is doing, you'll do certain damage. I won't try to explain how I do it personally, for fear of giving people the idea that it's ok to do so. I can also shift from 123456, and 654321, without the clutch. Only because I've worked on cars all my life, and have a well earned feel for it. But the bottom line is don't try either. I'll continue to do so, and if it gives me trouble I'll tear it down myself and post a bunch of pics for you guys.