UK & Ireland S2000 Community Discussions related to the S2000, its ownership and enthusiasm for it in the UK and Ireland. Including FAQs, and technical questions.

Section 59 Warning

Thread Tools
 
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:06 AM
  #1  
GrittyShaker's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 30,169
Likes: 0
From: Right here, right now
Default Section 59 Warning

I got one last night, but I'm still not sure exactly what it was for. It seems a bit vague. I will fully admit to "giving it the beans", but I wasn't doing anything I would have perceived as dangerous and/or illegal.

Here is the location:



It's a two lane exit from a roundabout, heading towards a 3-lane bit of the A19. I was in the empty lane 1, and a queue of traffic was in lane 2, probably travelling at around 40mph.

I zipped along lane 1, at a reasonable pace. I didn't exceed the speed limit (70mph), and actually probably eased off at around 60mph. I did use Vtec (the snow has cleared up here), and my airbox lid is off. I then joined the main queue of traffic and ambled along with the flow of it.

I didn't think it was considered untertaking if I was on a slip road like that. Can someone clarify? If it is, then oops.

In the meantime an unmarked Focus ST pulled out of lane two and started tailgating me. If I'd have had to step on the brakes for any reason, they would have been straight into the back of me, but that's another issue.

Several seconds later the blue lights came on, and I was told this:

(b) is causing, or is likely to cause, alarm, distress or annoyance to members of the public,
So was I pulled for undertaking? Presumably I would have been done for a "proper" offence, such as dangerous driving, if that was the case?

Or was I done for using Vtec (being noisy), or a combination of the two?

Here is da law:
59 Vehicles used in manner causing alarm, distress or annoyance
(1) Where a constable in uniform has reasonable grounds for believing that a motor vehicle is being used on any occasion in a manner which—
(a) contravenes section 3 or 34 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 (c. 52) (careless and inconsiderate driving and prohibition of off-road driving), and
(b) is causing, or is likely to cause, alarm, distress or annoyance to members of the public,
he shall have the powers set out in subsection (3).
(2) A constable in uniform shall also have the powers set out in subsection (3) where he has reasonable grounds for believing that a motor vehicle has been used on any occasion in a manner falling within subsection (1).
(3) Those powers are—
(a) power, if the motor vehicle is moving, to order the person driving it to stop the vehicle;
(b) power to seize and remove the motor vehicle;
© power, for the purposes of exercising a power falling within paragraph (a) or (b), to enter any premises on which he has reasonable grounds for believing the motor vehicle to be;
(d) power to use reasonable force, if necessary, in the exercise of any power conferred by any of paragraphs to (a) to ©.
(4) A constable shall not seize a motor vehicle in the exercise of the powers conferred on him by this section unless—
(a) he has warned the person appearing to him to be the person whose use falls within subsection (1) that he will seize it, if that use continues or is repeated; and
(b) it appears to him that the use has continued or been repeated after the the warning.
(5) Subsection (4) does not require a warning to be given by a constable on any occasion on which he would otherwise have the power to seize a motor vehicle under this section if—
(a) the circumstances make it impracticable for him to give the warning;
(b) the constable has already on that occasion given a warning under that subsection in respect of any use of that motor vehicle or of another motor vehicle by that person or any other person;
© the constable has reasonable grounds for believing that such a warning has been given on that occasion otherwise than by him; or
(d) the constable has reasonable grounds for believing that the person whose use of that motor vehicle on that occasion would justify the seizure is a person to whom a warning under that subsection has been given (whether or not by that constable or in respect the same vehicle or the same or a similar use) on a previous occasion in the previous twelve months.
(6) A person who fails to comply with an order under subsection (3)(a) is guilty of an offence and shall be liable, on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale.
(7) Subsection (3)© does not authorise entry into a private dwelling house.
(8) The powers conferred on a constable by this section shall be exercisable only at a time when regulations under section 60 are in force.
(9) In this section—
“driving” has the same meaning as in the Road Traffic Act 1988 (c. 52);
“motor vehicle” means any mechanically propelled vehicle, whether or not it is intended or adapted for use on roads; and
“private dwelling house” does not include any garage or other structure occupied with the dwelling house, or any land appurtenant to the dwelling house.
In bold is what they said I was doing.

I've lost count of the number of times I've been alarmed, distressed or annoyed by a sudden burst of sirens and flashing blue lights nearby.

So it's a maximum of 3000rpm for the next 12 months, otherwise they will impound my car.

*Edited title for clarity*
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:12 AM
  #2  
MarkB's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,979
Likes: 0
From: North Yorks
Default

It was a law supposed to allow the police to seize Barried up Saxos at cruises.
If the cars were legal but local residents were annoyed or distressed ( ) then the police could issue a S59 and if the driver was cought again, his car was impounded.

A kneejerk law, wide open to misapplication and misinterperetation, but giving the police more powers they didn't need.

Seems Cleveland police are using to to up their crime clearup statistics (your 'crime' was commited and cleared up all in one nice tidy operation, making their stats look better, wonder if their clearup rate for burglary is as good.....).

You have my sympathies.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:13 AM
  #3  
sean_f's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: Fife, Scotland
Default

Sounds like ASBO legislation. We have similar up here in Scotland but our legislation differs:

Contravention of Section 3 (careless driving) or 34 (driving on a place other than a road) leads to the driver being warned for anti social behaviour and the vehicle being tagged.

This is then registered on PNC.

If that person or that vehicle is found to contravene Sections 3 or 34 again, the vehicle is seized (or the other vehicle the person is using).

We cannot do this on the first warning, however.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:19 AM
  #4  
Gaspode's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,905
Likes: 0
Default

Didn't you ask?

I would have.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:22 AM
  #5  
GrittyShaker's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 30,169
Likes: 0
From: Right here, right now
Default

Originally Posted by sean_f,Jan 14 2010, 10:13 AM
Sounds like ASBO legislation.
I need to start wearing a baseball cap, and tucking my "trackies" into my socks.

To be honest, I was more bothered about the officer's attitude more than anything else. His arrogance was astonishing.

Oh, I forgot to add this bit. Once they'd let me out of the car he told me to "'ang on a minute", then proceeded to search my car. He then said that he could smell cannabis on me. I'd been at work all day, and haven't smoked that since my teens (and I don't think the smell lingers for that long).

I offered the explanation that I smoke roll-ups (which is true), so perhaps it was that. He said, no, it's definitely cannabis. Then he called me back to their car, and breathalised me, before sending me on my way.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:22 AM
  #6  
MarkB's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,979
Likes: 0
From: North Yorks
Default

If you look, there is this (my emphasis);

(a) contravenes section 3 or 34 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 (c. 52) (careless and inconsiderate driving and prohibition of off-road driving), and
(b) is causing, or is likely to cause, alarm, distress or annoyance to members of the public

So unless you went off road, you have to have contravened S3, "3. If a person drives a motor vehicle on a road without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road, he is guilty of an offence."

If he's saying you were given an official warning about the "distress or annoyance", you also had to be driving without due care, or rasonable consideration for others" otherwise he couldn't have issued the warning.

If you could be bothered, it might be worth a letter to the area commander.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:25 AM
  #7  
eSeM's Avatar
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 39,548
Likes: 11
From: City Of London / Knebworth
Default

You have a nice car and this is likely to cause 'distress or annoyance' to those who do not.

This is

Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:30 AM
  #8  
veehexx's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,714
Likes: 1
From: coventry, UK
Default

surely the S with airbox lid off abides by noise regulations (there are covered in MOT, but rarely enforced ime) and thus 100% completely legal even when giving it beans.

(i presume they are going with the VTEC noise rather than anything else)
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:31 AM
  #9  
The Loon's Avatar
Community Organizer
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 6,810
Likes: 3
From: MUGEN 無限 POWER
Default

If you are worried about this and want proper legal advice contact Jeff Brailsford at Vincents Solicitors in Preston.

He knows a thing or two about speeding and motoring related offences. He also advises readers in Banzai Magazine.
Reply
Old Jan 14, 2010 | 01:32 AM
  #10  
M1TT J's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 157
Likes: 0
Default

I got one of these a good few years ago now. Just dont get another one in the next 12 months otherwise they take your car and charge you the earth to get it back!
Reply



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:25 PM.