What are the best all out track tires for a stock S2000 with stock wheels?
08-23-2002, 01:42 PM
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What are the best all out track tires for a stock S2000 with stock wheels?
What are the best all out track tires for a bone stock s2000 with factory wheels? (Brand and size) (Tire will not be used on the street)
Right now I am considering a set of heat cycled Hoosiers
Fronts: 205/45ZR16's 'or' 225/50ZR16
Rears: 245/45ZR16 'or' 275/45ZR16
I drive very aggressively at the track, and the S02's don't cut it. Also would like to lose the mild 'push' the car exhibits at speed without messing up my street alignment (drive daily with S02's)
No tire rub please!
Help!!!
Right now I am considering a set of heat cycled Hoosiers
Fronts: 205/45ZR16's 'or' 225/50ZR16
Rears: 245/45ZR16 'or' 275/45ZR16
I drive very aggressively at the track, and the S02's don't cut it. Also would like to lose the mild 'push' the car exhibits at speed without messing up my street alignment (drive daily with S02's)
No tire rub please!
Help!!!
08-23-2002, 05:31 PM
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I would highly recommend the 225 275 Hoosier setup... using the 225s is the only way to loose the push with out doing anything else, besides it will help increase your braking ability. Others here will likely PooPoo the 275s as being too wide. And they are probably right... but they are still much better then the 245s in the rear. especially when matched with 225s up front.
Thats my story and i'm sticking to it
Thats my story and i'm sticking to it
08-24-2002, 01:10 AM
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well... here my take:
225s up front and 245s in the back are already a bad fit on the stock wheels. so sure... put some 275s on the back that fit even worse and are tall enough to effect the gearing in a negative way. Oh and of course if you're not going to change your alignment from your street setup so you can expect the tires to wear even worse than normal (which is already going to be bad because they're on an undersized rim). All in all, a good recipe for chewing up $650 worth of Hoosiers way before their time.
My advice is get a second set of rims in a good size... say 7.5" up front and 8.5" in the back.. now put some 225s/245s on them (now they'll actually be a good fit) and get a big front swaybar. It'll drive a hell of a lot better and probably cost the same or even less in the long run.
Whats the point of racing on the factory wheels if you dont have to? Are you racing with some seires that says you have to? If you not, i think its a bad idea and will be costing you tire money.
-jason keeney
225s up front and 245s in the back are already a bad fit on the stock wheels. so sure... put some 275s on the back that fit even worse and are tall enough to effect the gearing in a negative way. Oh and of course if you're not going to change your alignment from your street setup so you can expect the tires to wear even worse than normal (which is already going to be bad because they're on an undersized rim). All in all, a good recipe for chewing up $650 worth of Hoosiers way before their time.
My advice is get a second set of rims in a good size... say 7.5" up front and 8.5" in the back.. now put some 225s/245s on them (now they'll actually be a good fit) and get a big front swaybar. It'll drive a hell of a lot better and probably cost the same or even less in the long run.
Whats the point of racing on the factory wheels if you dont have to? Are you racing with some seires that says you have to? If you not, i think its a bad idea and will be costing you tire money.
-jason keeney
08-24-2002, 07:02 AM
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I would recommend the Michelin Pilot Sport CUp tire. Everyone one that I have talked to says they are faster than the Hoosiers and gives you 4 times as long of tread life. You can stay 205/55R16 front and 245/45R16 rear. They also do make a 225/50R16 for the front.
Jim 800-428-8355-364
Jim 800-428-8355-364
08-24-2002, 10:44 AM
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I call double poo-poo! 
Jim, you haven't talked to me! The Michelins are not faster than a Hoosier in its prime. Nothing this side of a non-DOT slick is. At the track they're about as fast as a Kumho, but last longer. Though after 2 track days, 4 autocrosses, and 4000 street miles mine are no longer even track worthy.
Jason 619.247.2564
Ditto what j2k said on the wheel/tire size thing too. If you're going to get another set of rims, the 17" Volk Ce-28Ns are a killer wheel that's reasonably priced, and the 225/255 -17 combination works great. If you've never used R-compound tires before you may want to try the Kumhos, Toyo RA1s, or the Michelin PSCs. They all stick way better than S-02s and I think you'll be happier with their grip/life balance.
Jim, you haven't talked to me! The Michelins are not faster than a Hoosier in its prime. Nothing this side of a non-DOT slick is. At the track they're about as fast as a Kumho, but last longer. Though after 2 track days, 4 autocrosses, and 4000 street miles mine are no longer even track worthy.
Jason 619.247.2564
Ditto what j2k said on the wheel/tire size thing too. If you're going to get another set of rims, the 17" Volk Ce-28Ns are a killer wheel that's reasonably priced, and the 225/255 -17 combination works great. If you've never used R-compound tires before you may want to try the Kumhos, Toyo RA1s, or the Michelin PSCs. They all stick way better than S-02s and I think you'll be happier with their grip/life balance.
08-25-2002, 08:31 AM
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My pick would be shaved (4/32) Toyo RA1's from Vilven Tire, who supplies Toyo's to the Speedvision WC guys. Vilven does not charge extra for shaving and quoted prices are typically for shaved and delivered. Toyo's are a great tire: Equivalent if not better grip than Kumhos, longer wear, and a tendency not to go 'off' as dramatically as Hoosiers and even Kumhos.
The Pilots offer slightly better grip but not worth the expense IMHO.
Gotta get the Toyos shaved though, as with 8/32's of tread, you'll get too much tread squirm and tend to overheat the tires. They'll last as long if not longer than unshaved, and perform better.
A note on heat cycling: I've had better luck doing it myself than with Tire Rack's service. Not worth the money IMHO.
The Pilots offer slightly better grip but not worth the expense IMHO.
Gotta get the Toyos shaved though, as with 8/32's of tread, you'll get too much tread squirm and tend to overheat the tires. They'll last as long if not longer than unshaved, and perform better.
A note on heat cycling: I've had better luck doing it myself than with Tire Rack's service. Not worth the money IMHO.
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08-27-2002, 10:55 AM
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non-DOT slick is of course the best to answer question.
saying that the narrow stock rim is inappropriate for hoosiers in 225/245 or 275 is naive tire engineering talk. a narrower rim for given tire footprint actually gives more grip if u examine only this aspect. there may be other issues such as keeping it on the rim, heat, driver feedback,etc., but for grip, the narrower rim, if it works, provides higher lateral G. go take a look at the rim width to section width in the fastest race cars there are(F1, Champ,IRL, NASCAR, blah,blah).
saying that the narrow stock rim is inappropriate for hoosiers in 225/245 or 275 is naive tire engineering talk. a narrower rim for given tire footprint actually gives more grip if u examine only this aspect. there may be other issues such as keeping it on the rim, heat, driver feedback,etc., but for grip, the narrower rim, if it works, provides higher lateral G. go take a look at the rim width to section width in the fastest race cars there are(F1, Champ,IRL, NASCAR, blah,blah).
08-27-2002, 12:38 PM
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by sfphinkterMC
[B]non-DOT slick is of course the best to answer question.
saying that the narrow stock rim is inappropriate for hoosiers in 225/245 or 275 is naive tire engineering talk. a narrower rim for given tire footprint actually gives more grip if u examine only this aspect. there may be other issues such as keeping it on the rim, heat, driver feedback,etc., but for grip, the narrower rim, if it works, provides higher lateral G.
[B]non-DOT slick is of course the best to answer question.
saying that the narrow stock rim is inappropriate for hoosiers in 225/245 or 275 is naive tire engineering talk. a narrower rim for given tire footprint actually gives more grip if u examine only this aspect. there may be other issues such as keeping it on the rim, heat, driver feedback,etc., but for grip, the narrower rim, if it works, provides higher lateral G.
08-27-2002, 01:26 PM
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frayed,
what is your specific experience? i am referring to grip, and i qualified feedback, although that's subjective. it's analogous to using a smaller diam. rim with higher sidewall...that gives more grip....in all wheeled motorsports(drag racing, sand rails, mountain bikes). also i dispute your flatter contact patch, a wider rim dimimiishes the conformability with roll. now there is an optimum width u could test for for lap time, not too narrow...but also not too wide....which is also undesirable unsprung weight.
tires grip more with more flexibility in side wall to form contact patch....my point is to not dismiss the 225/275 hoosiers on stock rim width 'cause they may grip terrific and yield better lap times than mounting on 1 inch wider rims. krazik's vs davepk's blazing laptimes at thunderhill support this. check the stock rim, NA car vs. S/C with inch bigger rim cars lap times, even with differing driver factor! massive hoosiers on factory S2K rims stick like snot!!
since u already own the stock rims, and they have appropriate offsets, u have the benefit of using them at no additional cost. and...thats what this thread is all about anyway, maximizing these rims for the track. that doesn't stop me from running MF-10'S AS WELL!!!
what is your specific experience? i am referring to grip, and i qualified feedback, although that's subjective. it's analogous to using a smaller diam. rim with higher sidewall...that gives more grip....in all wheeled motorsports(drag racing, sand rails, mountain bikes). also i dispute your flatter contact patch, a wider rim dimimiishes the conformability with roll. now there is an optimum width u could test for for lap time, not too narrow...but also not too wide....which is also undesirable unsprung weight.
tires grip more with more flexibility in side wall to form contact patch....my point is to not dismiss the 225/275 hoosiers on stock rim width 'cause they may grip terrific and yield better lap times than mounting on 1 inch wider rims. krazik's vs davepk's blazing laptimes at thunderhill support this. check the stock rim, NA car vs. S/C with inch bigger rim cars lap times, even with differing driver factor! massive hoosiers on factory S2K rims stick like snot!!
since u already own the stock rims, and they have appropriate offsets, u have the benefit of using them at no additional cost. and...thats what this thread is all about anyway, maximizing these rims for the track. that doesn't stop me from running MF-10'S AS WELL!!!