The Formula 1 Thread - 2011
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From: In Bed..... fordshire
Originally Posted by GarethB' timestamp='1314646241' post='20924601
Clearly.
Hamilton was drifting over to the left, Kobayashi turned in when he could have braked and have avoided the accident.
Hamilton was drifting over to the left, Kobayashi turned in when he could have braked and have avoided the accident.
As one or two said on the BBC coverage, he was never going to overtake Hamilton round the outside so why did he even try?
50/50 I would say. They were both trying it on; they were both playing chicken and not being the first to blink, and they both could have left a bit more room or backed off.
Just because some people did manage to overtake around the outside doesn't mean that in that situation on that bend it was possible. As mentioned would he have even put his car there on a street circuit?
The video shows Kobayashi turned in. Look at the distance between his tyre and the outside of the track at 44 seconds.
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From: Lincolnshire Wolds
Originally Posted by keith2.2' timestamp='1314689679' post='20926475
Hamilton / Kobayashi - Hamilton was in front so was within his rights to move over to the racing line - it was a gradual move, not a sudden swerve so the Kobykazi (who I take a lot of entertainment from, btw) would hardly have been taken by surprise. I think Hamilton SHOULD ultimately have seen him in the mirrors and stopped moving across, likewise Kobayashi should have seen the gap he was aiming for was diminishing and lifted.
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
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From: Herts
Originally Posted by Ultra_Nexus' timestamp='1314741674' post='20928851
[quote name='keith2.2' timestamp='1314689679' post='20926475']
Hamilton / Kobayashi - Hamilton was in front so was within his rights to move over to the racing line - it was a gradual move, not a sudden swerve so the Kobykazi (who I take a lot of entertainment from, btw) would hardly have been taken by surprise. I think Hamilton SHOULD ultimately have seen him in the mirrors and stopped moving across, likewise Kobayashi should have seen the gap he was aiming for was diminishing and lifted.
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
Hamilton / Kobayashi - Hamilton was in front so was within his rights to move over to the racing line - it was a gradual move, not a sudden swerve so the Kobykazi (who I take a lot of entertainment from, btw) would hardly have been taken by surprise. I think Hamilton SHOULD ultimately have seen him in the mirrors and stopped moving across, likewise Kobayashi should have seen the gap he was aiming for was diminishing and lifted.
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
[/quote]
At least The Partnership will be pleased
The fact is that a number of actual racing drivers and team bosses have had conflicting views, so it seems a somewhat churlish comment?I'd have to argue anyway - actually reading what I said;
Hamilton- SHOULD have checked his mirrors - he either didn't know there was a car there when he moved across, or he was deliberately trying to take a piece of road that had a car on it - and it didn't come off.
Kobs - I didn't say that he was in the wrong at all - purely that at one point, it was clear that he was running out of road, and he'd have been better off (well ok, in this instance, HE wouldn't have been, but that's with the benefit of hindsight) ensuring he was there to fight another corner.
Agree with Dembo - assuming both drivers were aware of where they were (and they ought to have been...) it was a game of chicken and neither party blinked. Hats off to both of them for it..but..
"To finish first, first you have to finish"
Two ways to look at it really - both drivers wanted the same bit of road, both were racing - it happens.
Same coin - both drivers wanted the same bit of road, at least one of them knew it wasn't going to be there - both drivers should want to finish the race.
Still, it's all lovely and easy to dissect something like this with the benefit of video replays and a keyboard with which to compose a thoughtful "what he SHOULD have done was.." - we're not making the decision in milliseconds slowing from 200mph in cars that we don't have to pay for if they do get broken.
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From: Frustration
Originally Posted by Ultra_Nexus' timestamp='1314741674' post='20928851
[quote name='keith2.2' timestamp='1314689679' post='20926475']
Hamilton / Kobayashi - Hamilton was in front so was within his rights to move over to the racing line - it was a gradual move, not a sudden swerve so the Kobykazi (who I take a lot of entertainment from, btw) would hardly have been taken by surprise. I think Hamilton SHOULD ultimately have seen him in the mirrors and stopped moving across, likewise Kobayashi should have seen the gap he was aiming for was diminishing and lifted.
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
Hamilton / Kobayashi - Hamilton was in front so was within his rights to move over to the racing line - it was a gradual move, not a sudden swerve so the Kobykazi (who I take a lot of entertainment from, btw) would hardly have been taken by surprise. I think Hamilton SHOULD ultimately have seen him in the mirrors and stopped moving across, likewise Kobayashi should have seen the gap he was aiming for was diminishing and lifted.
Question - had that been a wall on the Valencia street circuit, would he still have kept it pinned? Ultimately, he was only ever going to be trying to overtake Hamilton around the outside of the bend - a move that just wasn't ever going to happen.
Both drivers could have done more, but I think Hamilton was LESS at fault..
[/quote]
My post wasn't limited to a vocation.
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From: Here and awake!
Racing incidents happen all the time, it is why we watch F1 and other motor sports. I was slightly disappointed with the race to be honest, the highlight was Webber's overtake of Alonso omfg in my opinion that guy had committed early to making the manoeuvre and thought 'wtf I have to go through with it now' ... I don't think I have ever seen that before, sheer blind faith or balls of steel either way massively impressive.
Not a bad race, just not classic Spa for me.
Not a bad race, just not classic Spa for me.
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Posts: 6,690
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From: Guildford
From BBC/F1 gossip
"Iran could be the next Middle East country to join the Formula 1 circuit after announcing plans to build a track in Parand City, 35km south of Tehran. Alireza Sabbagh, executive manager of the project, said: "Iran has so many young people and there is an increasing tendency for them to drive. F1 has a great future there."
......could be interesting.
"Iran could be the next Middle East country to join the Formula 1 circuit after announcing plans to build a track in Parand City, 35km south of Tehran. Alireza Sabbagh, executive manager of the project, said: "Iran has so many young people and there is an increasing tendency for them to drive. F1 has a great future there."
......could be interesting.
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From: Southampton/Reading
Italian Grand Prix
Track:- Autodromo Nationale Monza,
DRS Zones:- Start/Finish straight and between Lesmo 2 and Ascari
When:- 9-11 September
Friday 9 September:
Practice one - 0900-1030
Practice two - 1300-1430
Saturday 10 September:
Practice three - 1000-1100;
Qualifying - 1300-1400
Sunday 11 September:
Race - 1300
News:-
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/94283 - Pirelli reduce camber limit on tyres after blistering at Spa for RBR
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/09/0...teering-italy/ - Team Lotus have their power steering back, so expect a strong result for TL in Quali
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/09/0...-prix-preview/ - Ferrari going for glory at their home GP and a general review
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/09/0...-monza-harlow/ - DRS effect reduced at Monza as all cars will be running a low downforce set up due to high speed nature of Monza
Coverage as per normal on BBC One/HD, iPlayer, Five Live, Red Button
Should be a great weekend at a fantastic track!
Graham