For those planning on running Gateway Sat.
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 376
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From: Spring Hill
For those planning on running Gateway Sat.
Keith got me in contact with the folks running the SCCA Drivers Education event at Gateway this weekend. While they did adopt me as an instructor for their event, the rules for convertibles are clearly NOT S2000 friendly. The full text of the rules is in section 18 (page 42) of the following document:
http://scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/20...rialsRules.pdf
I'm hoping for the best, but I doubt that anyone of average (or greater) height can meet the listed criteria. They want 2" of clearance between the top of your helmet and the roll hoop, no exceptions. I'm hoping for some leeway from the tech guy, so I'll keep you posted with what I find out. I suspect that I'm going to have to use the VW or bail on the entire event - which would be a shame.
The insurance companies/lawyers seem hell bent on prohibiting any car without a roof from ever touching a racetrack. The most rediculous part of the rules is the exemption given to any car with a hardtop. Apparently, these "bolt on" roofs are made from the same stuff used to construct UFO's and are completely impervious to coming loose from the car, or colapsing in any way, shape or form. Otherwise, I cannot rationalize why a car with a hartop should justify exemption from the "no exception" rule...
I wonder if I can fool them into thinking that the cloth top is actually a hardtop in disguise! Looks like everyone is going to need to invest in a $3500 hardtop just to satisfy the SCCA (this won't work for the BMW or PCA groups, they still require the 2" helmet to hoop clearance, hardtop or no hardtop).
Greg
http://scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/20...rialsRules.pdf
I'm hoping for the best, but I doubt that anyone of average (or greater) height can meet the listed criteria. They want 2" of clearance between the top of your helmet and the roll hoop, no exceptions. I'm hoping for some leeway from the tech guy, so I'll keep you posted with what I find out. I suspect that I'm going to have to use the VW or bail on the entire event - which would be a shame.
The insurance companies/lawyers seem hell bent on prohibiting any car without a roof from ever touching a racetrack. The most rediculous part of the rules is the exemption given to any car with a hardtop. Apparently, these "bolt on" roofs are made from the same stuff used to construct UFO's and are completely impervious to coming loose from the car, or colapsing in any way, shape or form. Otherwise, I cannot rationalize why a car with a hartop should justify exemption from the "no exception" rule...
I wonder if I can fool them into thinking that the cloth top is actually a hardtop in disguise! Looks like everyone is going to need to invest in a $3500 hardtop just to satisfy the SCCA (this won't work for the BMW or PCA groups, they still require the 2" helmet to hoop clearance, hardtop or no hardtop).
Greg
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,585
Likes: 2
From: Ballwin (St. Louis)
I'm actually working on this Greg...
They pretty much told me that if I provide supporting documents that the S2000 has roll over protection behind the driver/passenger and the driver sits below the roll bars, they will allow it. They allowed a handful of other roadsters with factory roll over protection at the last event. That said, someone like Nick should be ok to participate this weekend. I contacted Honda America and they gave me links to various articles supporting the fact that the S2000 has factory roll over protection. I've supplied this to the SCCA and they are checking to see if this is satisfactory. I'll keep you and Nick posted but that's about it... I don't think anybody from this group is interested in bringing their car out to the track. I might run my S2000 if it rains this weekend.
Keith
They pretty much told me that if I provide supporting documents that the S2000 has roll over protection behind the driver/passenger and the driver sits below the roll bars, they will allow it. They allowed a handful of other roadsters with factory roll over protection at the last event. That said, someone like Nick should be ok to participate this weekend. I contacted Honda America and they gave me links to various articles supporting the fact that the S2000 has factory roll over protection. I've supplied this to the SCCA and they are checking to see if this is satisfactory. I'll keep you and Nick posted but that's about it... I don't think anybody from this group is interested in bringing their car out to the track. I might run my S2000 if it rains this weekend.
Keith
oh sure I get it, I will be OK either way since I'm only 5'8". Thanks alot Keith. You really know how to hurt a guy... 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,585
Likes: 2
From: Ballwin (St. Louis)
I don't think the PCA, BMWCCA and Audi clubs will budge on their stance (broomstick with 2" rule) on convertibles unfortunately.
This is what I got from Honda and what I sent the SCCA:
http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.a...=20010220001302
Even though open-topped cars are exempted, the S2000 meets the federal standard for occupant protection in a rollover accident. The driver's and passenger's roll bars are made of 1.5-inch diameter high-strength steel pipe with a .080-inch wall thickness, and tie directly into the frame. Additional protection is provided by reinforced door pillars, windshield posts and the windshield frame.
http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.a...id=200707112303
Roll Bars and Air Deflector
The S2000's roll bars combine with the car's reinforced windshield frame to help form a protective area for the driver's and passenger's heads in the event of a rollover. A clear acrylic panel is located between the driver's and passenger's roll bars and acts as a wind deflector to help reduce cockpit turbulence.
Keith
This is what I got from Honda and what I sent the SCCA:
http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.a...=20010220001302
Even though open-topped cars are exempted, the S2000 meets the federal standard for occupant protection in a rollover accident. The driver's and passenger's roll bars are made of 1.5-inch diameter high-strength steel pipe with a .080-inch wall thickness, and tie directly into the frame. Additional protection is provided by reinforced door pillars, windshield posts and the windshield frame.
http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.a...id=200707112303
Roll Bars and Air Deflector
The S2000's roll bars combine with the car's reinforced windshield frame to help form a protective area for the driver's and passenger's heads in the event of a rollover. A clear acrylic panel is located between the driver's and passenger's roll bars and acts as a wind deflector to help reduce cockpit turbulence.
Keith
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 376
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From: Spring Hill
Great news! Now I can put off that VW work for a bit longer. I have new brake pads in-bound too, so I should be in good shape by Saturday morning.
So it's just Keith, Nick and I for Saturday? We need to get more people out there!
Greg
So it's just Keith, Nick and I for Saturday? We need to get more people out there!
Greg
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From: St. Louis
Originally Posted by FireF4ly,Aug 21 2007, 04:11 PM
Ohhhh I'll be out there, but I'm still looking to ride shotgun.
Keith-
great work! When I talked to Jan form SCCA she said that next season it is possible that they will have package pricing for the DE's - and they might add one more to the schedule. Accorfding to her, they are very popular. Greg - can't wait to try and keep up with you in an S. I am sure I will learn alot from you on Saturday.
