Im not sure if this is the right place.....but?
02-28-2010, 09:00 PM
#1
Im not sure if this is the right place.....but?
I figured I would post this in here because I felt the people on this board value authentic products the more then anyone else. So here is my question.
I am not sure if Im going to get flamed for this, but honestly this is something that genuinely bothers me. I just want to know how in the world are these companys, "not going to say any names" but they are blatently ripping off every japaneese company aero design. I dont know how they are getting around patents and arent getting their pants sued off.
I worked at abercrombie's corporate office for many years actually as a concept designer and when working there I saw first hand so many of these small distributers caught making fake abercrombie clothing, shut down, then sued and even bigger companys "example" forever 21 flat out copying big time designers work and getting sued by numerous designers.
I just want to know how and why this continues? I mean there are even vendors on here that just mass produce so many products and not one of them are their own designs!
Could some one please enlighten me? I mean if it was a incredibly rare part that is no longer available to the market that would be a little more understandable, but making a compapny solely based off stealing someone elses hard work is just pathetic in my eyes!
I am not sure if Im going to get flamed for this, but honestly this is something that genuinely bothers me. I just want to know how in the world are these companys, "not going to say any names" but they are blatently ripping off every japaneese company aero design. I dont know how they are getting around patents and arent getting their pants sued off.
I worked at abercrombie's corporate office for many years actually as a concept designer and when working there I saw first hand so many of these small distributers caught making fake abercrombie clothing, shut down, then sued and even bigger companys "example" forever 21 flat out copying big time designers work and getting sued by numerous designers.
I just want to know how and why this continues? I mean there are even vendors on here that just mass produce so many products and not one of them are their own designs!
Could some one please enlighten me? I mean if it was a incredibly rare part that is no longer available to the market that would be a little more understandable, but making a compapny solely based off stealing someone elses hard work is just pathetic in my eyes!
03-01-2010, 10:30 AM
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The bottom line of it all is that everyone copies everyone. For example, going back to you working at Abercrombie. Was Abercrombie the first company to make a polo shirt? Well how dare you copy that design! You see what I'm saying?
It's supply and demand as well. Japanese companies take how long for their parts to get here? They charge how much for their parts? Thats all well and good, and there will always be purists out there. But people that dont have as deep of pockets, or the patience to wait for the originals will go with the cheaper and faster solution. It's the American way: "I want it cheap, and I want it now."
Also, and I might be wrong, I don't believe that most of those Japanese companies have patents for their aero products. If they did, I know for a fact that they aren't going after the replica companies. Even if they do have patents, it wouldn't be worth their time and money to fight them in court. If anything, they would probably contact the replica company, and they would probably find some middle ground resolution.
I'm not going to go out there and say what I think is right, and what is wrong. I will keep my opinions about aerodynamic body kit replicas to myself. But I will say that there are so many loop holes, and 'behind the scene' type things that happen that will always keep these replica companies doing what they do.
It's supply and demand as well. Japanese companies take how long for their parts to get here? They charge how much for their parts? Thats all well and good, and there will always be purists out there. But people that dont have as deep of pockets, or the patience to wait for the originals will go with the cheaper and faster solution. It's the American way: "I want it cheap, and I want it now."
Also, and I might be wrong, I don't believe that most of those Japanese companies have patents for their aero products. If they did, I know for a fact that they aren't going after the replica companies. Even if they do have patents, it wouldn't be worth their time and money to fight them in court. If anything, they would probably contact the replica company, and they would probably find some middle ground resolution.
I'm not going to go out there and say what I think is right, and what is wrong. I will keep my opinions about aerodynamic body kit replicas to myself. But I will say that there are so many loop holes, and 'behind the scene' type things that happen that will always keep these replica companies doing what they do.
03-01-2010, 01:47 PM
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IMO, this topic has run it's coarse within the S2KI community. I'm not knocking the question RUEHL925 - I'm just saying that for me personally, I've said everything I know to say in regards to this issue and I'm sure many others can say the same (on both sides of the fence).
It's kinda like religion, everyone has their own particular point of view, and everyone is trying to ram what they think is righteous down the throat of all of the non-believers.
I personally do not, and will not support these replica manufactures, but that's just me.
It's kinda like religion, everyone has their own particular point of view, and everyone is trying to ram what they think is righteous down the throat of all of the non-believers.
I personally do not, and will not support these replica manufactures, but that's just me.
03-01-2010, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by mr flannery77,Mar 1 2010, 02:47 PM
IMO, this topic has run it's coarse within the S2KI community. I'm not knocking the question RUEHL925 - I'm just saying that for me personally, I've said everything I know to say in regards to this issue and I'm sure many others can say the same (on both sides of the fence).
It's kinda like religion, everyone has their own particular point of view, and everyone is trying to ram what they think is righteous down the throat of all of the non-believers.
It's kinda like religion, everyone has their own particular point of view, and everyone is trying to ram what they think is righteous down the throat of all of the non-believers.
Can't we all just get along and enjoy the hobby of modifying cars whether that be with cheaper replica parts, or super JDM ultra expensive parts? We are all in this to enjoy it.
03-01-2010, 06:04 PM
#6
The fact you say everyone copys everyone is funny. The polo shirt was kind of a poor example.. A polo is not a design, it is a type of shirt. Im talking about "stealing" designs! I was not saying these people can not make bumpers, hoods, fenders etc. because honda already makes these parts. If that was the case there would be no such thing as "aftermarket".
I was in their R&D department for over 2 years . We analized other brands of clothing on a daily basis. We looked at certain parts of the clothing we liked, how they created a stich, or how they created a certain print technique, things that we liked about the other brands and how to apply it to our brand. Thats looking at the competitors products, and doing the research on how to make your product up to par with the competitor or make them better....not stealing the design my friend.
If we were going to be using clothing a better example would be something like...These companys products are of the same level as going to a flea market and picking up that fake Abercrombie t-shirt .
If these companys want to sell parts. They have their own resorces. They should hire designers, their own techs, their own r&d department....make their "own" parts and not steal someone elses work!
Maybe its because of my work background, but I do know first hand how much hard work, manpower, creativity is put behind actually creating new proucts. I dont think you were really getting the point !
Maybe you should change your everyone copys everyone statement to.....there will always be people who will copy!
I was in their R&D department for over 2 years . We analized other brands of clothing on a daily basis. We looked at certain parts of the clothing we liked, how they created a stich, or how they created a certain print technique, things that we liked about the other brands and how to apply it to our brand. Thats looking at the competitors products, and doing the research on how to make your product up to par with the competitor or make them better....not stealing the design my friend.
If we were going to be using clothing a better example would be something like...These companys products are of the same level as going to a flea market and picking up that fake Abercrombie t-shirt .
If these companys want to sell parts. They have their own resorces. They should hire designers, their own techs, their own r&d department....make their "own" parts and not steal someone elses work!
Maybe its because of my work background, but I do know first hand how much hard work, manpower, creativity is put behind actually creating new proucts. I dont think you were really getting the point !
Maybe you should change your everyone copys everyone statement to.....there will always be people who will copy!
03-01-2010, 08:39 PM
#7
What you are comparing is copying vs conterfeiting. One is ethically questionable and the other is illegal. So long as said Aero Company does not sell it as the real deal, and presents it as a replica it's fair game.
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03-01-2010, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by rioyellows2k,Mar 1 2010, 09:39 PM
What you are comparing is copying vs conterfeiting. One is ethically questionable and the other is illegal. So long as said Aero Company does not sell it as the real deal, and presents it as a replica it's fair game.
03-02-2010, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by RUEHL925,Mar 1 2010, 07:04 PM
The fact you say everyone copys everyone is funny. The polo shirt was kind of a poor example.. A polo is not a design, it is a type of shirt. Im talking about "stealing" designs! I was not saying these people can not make bumpers, hoods, fenders etc. because honda already makes these parts. If that was the case there would be no such thing as "aftermarket".
I was in their R&D department for over 2 years . We analized other brands of clothing on a daily basis. We looked at certain parts of the clothing we liked, how they created a stich, or how they created a certain print technique, things that we liked about the other brands and how to apply it to our brand. Thats looking at the competitors products, and doing the research on how to make your product up to par with the competitor or make them better....not stealing the design my friend.
If we were going to be using clothing a better example would be something like...These companys products are of the same level as going to a flea market and picking up that fake Abercrombie t-shirt .
If these companys want to sell parts. They have their own resorces. They should hire designers, their own techs, their own r&d department....make their "own" parts and not steal someone elses work!
Maybe its because of my work background, but I do know first hand how much hard work, manpower, creativity is put behind actually creating new proucts. I dont think you were really getting the point !
Maybe you should change your everyone copys everyone statement to.....there will always be people who will copy!
I was in their R&D department for over 2 years . We analized other brands of clothing on a daily basis. We looked at certain parts of the clothing we liked, how they created a stich, or how they created a certain print technique, things that we liked about the other brands and how to apply it to our brand. Thats looking at the competitors products, and doing the research on how to make your product up to par with the competitor or make them better....not stealing the design my friend.
If we were going to be using clothing a better example would be something like...These companys products are of the same level as going to a flea market and picking up that fake Abercrombie t-shirt .
If these companys want to sell parts. They have their own resorces. They should hire designers, their own techs, their own r&d department....make their "own" parts and not steal someone elses work!
Maybe its because of my work background, but I do know first hand how much hard work, manpower, creativity is put behind actually creating new proucts. I dont think you were really getting the point !
Maybe you should change your everyone copys everyone statement to.....there will always be people who will copy!
Exhibit A (image provided from GoTuning's Website):
Exhibit B:
This is a pretty clear example where even a well respected Japanese company directly stole an idea from Porsche. So again, I go back to my statement: " The bottom line of it all is that everyone copies everyone." There is not really much more to say. It happens. It going to continue to happen. There is no stopping it. Like it has pretty much been said already; it doesn't matter how much kicking and screaming people do. The replica industry is too big for it to stop. Again, I think that we should all just be friends, and let bygones be bygones.
03-02-2010, 10:06 AM
#10
I agree they do look very alike, but that still in no way means everyone copys everyone. The asm bumber is a good example, but did ASM make a exact mold off Porshe and pop it onto a S2000? You know the answer is NO 
but the design is extremely questionable, but if thats the case who did Porshe copy then? Someone had to create the design! So your in fact saying C-west, J's, ASM, Amuse, or really just every other company on the planet all just copy each other?
Well I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that one.
But I do also get what you are saying. There are many people out there who just plain copy, and there are people who flat out steal, but there will always be originators.
I really was pointing out the companys who just take these aftermarket parts, make a mold and mass distribute them. I know there are tons of factors that come into play.
but say I make a part and start marketing it to the public, what would you do to try to keep one of these replica companys from taking your part and start selling it for half the price? Shouldnt you be the one to reap the benifits if you were the person who put all the hard work into creating the part?
Yet this replica X company just took a few hours, made a mold and bam they have your part you put all that hard work into
I just feel its not right.
And yes I am working on a small piece right now for the S, but its not a copy
but the design is extremely questionable, but if thats the case who did Porshe copy then? Someone had to create the design! So your in fact saying C-west, J's, ASM, Amuse, or really just every other company on the planet all just copy each other? Well I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that one.
But I do also get what you are saying. There are many people out there who just plain copy, and there are people who flat out steal, but there will always be originators.
I really was pointing out the companys who just take these aftermarket parts, make a mold and mass distribute them. I know there are tons of factors that come into play.
but say I make a part and start marketing it to the public, what would you do to try to keep one of these replica companys from taking your part and start selling it for half the price? Shouldnt you be the one to reap the benifits if you were the person who put all the hard work into creating the part?
Yet this replica X company just took a few hours, made a mold and bam they have your part you put all that hard work into
I just feel its not right.And yes I am working on a small piece right now for the S, but its not a copy