Off-topic Talk Where overpaid, underworked S2000 owners waste the worst part of their days before the drive home. This forum is for general chit chat and discussions not covered by the other off-topic forums.

Mojave Cross here to stay!

Thread Tools
 
Old Apr 28, 2010 | 01:52 PM
  #21  
ace123's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,187
Likes: 3
Default

Originally Posted by Saki GT,Apr 28 2010, 01:53 PM
Thats what religion is - the closer to God you are, the less freedom you have.


Not at all. Simply following a religious path does not make one blind. Closing one's eyes to truth is what makes us blind.

That can be said equally of the religious or the nonreligious, and it can even be said of some religions. But being close to God does not make one blind or shackled.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 05:28 AM
  #22  
JonBoy's Avatar
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 19,734
Likes: 247
Default

Originally Posted by s2000raj,Apr 28 2010, 11:13 AM
I guess I'm different. Although I respect the basic and good premise of religion, most religions are bastardized versions of the original good plan. They promote a lot of bad stuff and then fall back on the good stuff as reasons for their continued existence.
Good insight and I agree with you. I'm still a Christian but you won't find me lining up behind any denomination or system. They've all deviated from the original and while I'd normally say it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize it, their membership numbers say otherwise. Apparently you at least have to be an anesthesiologist to figure it out.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 07:53 AM
  #23  
RUGBY's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,118
Likes: 2
From: Bergen County, NJ
Default


Does the fact the Cross was erected over 60 years ago influence your view? It surely influences mine.

This is not about the current day erection of a religious symbol. I can think of few instances where I would support the placement of a Cross, Star of David, etc. on government owned land. However, this was placed 60+ years ago when the the climate in the country allowed this type of display. I believe their is some level of historical significance to the Cross, and that should take precedent over the current church/state argument.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 07:58 AM
  #24  
The Gasman's Avatar
Former Moderator
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 59,195
Likes: 1
From: Ventura, California, USA
Default

Originally Posted by RUGBY,Apr 29 2010, 07:53 AM
Does the fact the Cross was erected over 60 years ago influence your view? It surely influences mine.

This is not about the current day erection of a religious symbol. I can think of few instances where I would support the placement of a Cross, Star of David, etc. on government owned land. However, this was placed 60+ years ago when the the climate in the country allowed this type of display. I believe their is some level of historical significance to the Cross, and that should take precedent over the current church/state argument.
Historical significance is often called upon but often if you look at it not really valid.

For instance at one time slavery was legal. Since at one time it was legal in this country could someone argue that you could have slaves since the institution was there at when the country allowed this type of activity?
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 08:20 AM
  #25  
JonBoy's Avatar
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 19,734
Likes: 247
Default

Would you condemn people in the USA in 1840 for having a slave? Chances are, you'd have one yourself, given your financial status (assuming it was similar then as now). The fact that you currently don't believe in it doesn't change the fact that back then, you'd have probably been fine with it.

Accordingly, applying your personal belief today against something that was built in the 1940s (in a much different religious and political climate) is a somewhat similar situation, if not quite so extreme.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 08:45 AM
  #26  
The Gasman's Avatar
Former Moderator
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 59,195
Likes: 1
From: Ventura, California, USA
Default

Jon, my peeps weren't landowners in the US at that time. We'd have probably been slaves or workers. I think my peeps entered the US actually first as laborers in Cali to help build railroads.

That being said you and I are arguing two different points. Sure you'd agree with standards current to a time or place, but I'm saying in modern times you change old things to new standards.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 08:57 AM
  #27  
flyingelbowz's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 282
Likes: 0
Default

It's driving the satanists crazy. And trust me folks...satanism is practiced all across America, and in the highest halls of power.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 09:00 AM
  #28  
thebig33tuna's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 32,283
Likes: 0
From: Cincinnati, OH
Default

Originally Posted by flyingelbowz,Apr 29 2010, 11:57 AM
It's driving the satanists crazy. And trust me folks...satanism is practiced all across America, and in the highest halls of power.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 10:06 AM
  #29  
JonBoy's Avatar
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 19,734
Likes: 247
Default

Originally Posted by s2000raj,Apr 29 2010, 10:45 AM
Jon, my peeps weren't landowners in the US at that time. We'd have probably been slaves or workers. I think my peeps entered the US actually first as laborers in Cali to help build railroads.

That being said you and I are arguing two different points. Sure you'd agree with standards current to a time or place, but I'm saying in modern times you change old things to new standards.
Again, I have to disagree. If they did things a certain way back then, our current view shouldn't change the acceptance of something that was done a certain way (when it was acceptable to have done it).

That means that an old home with slave quarters wouldn't have the slave quarters necessarily torn down or destroyed but a new home being built obviously wouldn't have slave quarters designed into it, either. Like it or not, slave quarters existed back then and they are often preserved as a means of remembering and showing how things used to be.

I don't think we need to change previous designs/intents/accepted forms to current standards. If we did, we'd practically be changing history or, at the very least, destroying some of it.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2010 | 10:11 AM
  #30  
The Gasman's Avatar
Former Moderator
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 59,195
Likes: 1
From: Ventura, California, USA
Default

I see your point and it is a valid point. I guess it would be the interpretation then, because I have no good counterarguement.
Reply



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:34 PM.