KW Variant 3 Settings?
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BIlly EXCELLENT post! I've been lurking lol.and someone used my name so ....just to complete the picture the "no preload coilovers" have no preload only in full droop...as soon as you set it down the spring compresses to it's static weight setting...(just like the V3's)...oh you want to cornerweight the car too...ok to add weight you need to adjust the "body" up this ADDS preload on that corner and TAKES preload from all other corners...so the term preload applies to ALL suspension systems equally. Some have longer travel and are designed both in stroke and droop for each car they are tested on...some just "fit" the chassis... clevis part from column "A" damper from bin "C" topmount from supplier "D" (in orange please)........the No preload system can work the biggest problem I see is they even make all the parts smaller/shorter and keep the oil bath th the absolute minimum...they can be lighter...but lack the travel imo...ymmv...
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From: SoFlo
Damn it Robi...
Yes the asian coilovers enable the spring to be 'preloaded' in full droop. I agree all suspension is 'preloaded' once you put the car on teh ground and the weight of the car sits on the spring. BUT, most people talk about 'preload' -in preloading the spring in full droop.
An easier way to view it is simply, the spring perch determines the height the spring sits on (and thus the car sitting on the spring). If you look at it from that perspective it is much simpler than from the perspective of 'increasing preload' (raising ride height) by fighting the force of the spring and car's weight by pre-loading the spring even more to raise the car.
Just say raise the spring perch - and thus ride height.
Maybe I just really don't like how the word 'preload' is thrown around by many people who don't fully understand what they are commenting on.
Yes the asian coilovers enable the spring to be 'preloaded' in full droop. I agree all suspension is 'preloaded' once you put the car on teh ground and the weight of the car sits on the spring. BUT, most people talk about 'preload' -in preloading the spring in full droop.
An easier way to view it is simply, the spring perch determines the height the spring sits on (and thus the car sitting on the spring). If you look at it from that perspective it is much simpler than from the perspective of 'increasing preload' (raising ride height) by fighting the force of the spring and car's weight by pre-loading the spring even more to raise the car.
Just say raise the spring perch - and thus ride height.
Maybe I just really don't like how the word 'preload' is thrown around by many people who don't fully understand what they are commenting on.
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u r preaching to the converted ;-)
and my example moves the spring perch higher...as measured from the lower suspension attachment bolt....
I like you don't like the term preload...I use it only in classes where spring rate is non adjustable (like the scca touring classes) otherwise I'm always thinking of the spring in it's loaded condition (where it lives) not when the car is unloaded. Doing otherwise just confuses which spring /damper setup issues are really important.
and my example moves the spring perch higher...as measured from the lower suspension attachment bolt....
I like you don't like the term preload...I use it only in classes where spring rate is non adjustable (like the scca touring classes) otherwise I'm always thinking of the spring in it's loaded condition (where it lives) not when the car is unloaded. Doing otherwise just confuses which spring /damper setup issues are really important.
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From: ||-|| (()) ||\|| ||)) //\
Since we managed to get both of you into this conversation... 
May you please give us some advice about how much we can drop the ride height without messing with the RCs, having to use RCAs etc.? I Remember Robi said that 30mm is a tuning point. Using the lower edge of KW's recommended settings my car sits 35mm lower. Although it never hits the bumpstops at this height, since we clarified that raising the car will not have a negative impact on the way the spring operates should I raise it to lets say 25mm drop to be on the safe side ragarding RCs?
-of topic- BillJ, Ohlins are neither cheap or Asian and the do have a separate adjustment for preload. I understand that this is a totally different design, are there any reasons someone would like to use Ohlins instead of KW v3s? (i am referring to the DFV model which does not have separate compression/rebound adjustment, not custom versions which cost a fortune)
May you please give us some advice about how much we can drop the ride height without messing with the RCs, having to use RCAs etc.? I Remember Robi said that 30mm is a tuning point. Using the lower edge of KW's recommended settings my car sits 35mm lower. Although it never hits the bumpstops at this height, since we clarified that raising the car will not have a negative impact on the way the spring operates should I raise it to lets say 25mm drop to be on the safe side ragarding RCs?
-of topic- BillJ, Ohlins are neither cheap or Asian and the do have a separate adjustment for preload. I understand that this is a totally different design, are there any reasons someone would like to use Ohlins instead of KW v3s? (i am referring to the DFV model which does not have separate compression/rebound adjustment, not custom versions which cost a fortune)
Joined: Sep 2005
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From: Baraboo, WI
Originally Posted by Taseas,Oct 29 2009, 08:17 AM
Since we managed to get both of you into this conversation...
May you please give us some advice about how much we can drop the ride height without messing with the RCs, having to use RCAs etc.? I Remember Robi said that 30mm is a tuning point. Using the lower edge of KW's recommended settings my car sits 35mm lower. Although it never hits the bumpstops at this height, since we clarified that raising the car will not have a negative impact on the way the spring operates should I raise it to lets say 25mm drop to be on the safe side ragarding RCs?
-of topic- BillJ, Ohlins are neither cheap or Asian and the do have a separate adjustment for preload. I understand that this is a totally different design, are there any reasons someone would like to use Ohlins instead of KW v3s? (i am referring to the DFV model which does not have separate compression/rebound adjustment, not custom versions which cost a fortune)
May you please give us some advice about how much we can drop the ride height without messing with the RCs, having to use RCAs etc.? I Remember Robi said that 30mm is a tuning point. Using the lower edge of KW's recommended settings my car sits 35mm lower. Although it never hits the bumpstops at this height, since we clarified that raising the car will not have a negative impact on the way the spring operates should I raise it to lets say 25mm drop to be on the safe side ragarding RCs?
-of topic- BillJ, Ohlins are neither cheap or Asian and the do have a separate adjustment for preload. I understand that this is a totally different design, are there any reasons someone would like to use Ohlins instead of KW v3s? (i am referring to the DFV model which does not have separate compression/rebound adjustment, not custom versions which cost a fortune)
Thanks, Brian
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Originally Posted by Billj747,Oct 26 2009, 06:31 PM
After you set the suspension from those KW points, measure (ON A FLAT GROUND) from teh ground to the front and rear jack points.
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Originally Posted by Taseas,Oct 31 2009, 04:11 AM
Well i don't think that was they point... anyway guys would you please chime in order to end this very interesting and valuable conversation?
