SLICKS in the S2000 Challenge???
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John tells me I need to use the smiley faces and stuff more since sometimes people don't know when I'm joking or serious. He also says I need a tag line at the end, like Hayashi and Rhoades, and slick rick. So, I'm gonna give it a try:
Douglas,
I am afraid of you, I admit it
. The funny thing about the SQUEALER is he acted like he wasn't going to get caught for squealing. Seems like he got caught pretty easily, the poor little sucker, and I doubt he'll be privy to any more secrets 
.
Also, you're not wrong that, according to the rules, slicks are legal. I just didn't know what slicks were
. I'm rather interested in the experiment myself so I'd say we should let you do what you want with them until you win and then we'll know that they're a major huge unfair advantage .... otherwise, how could you have beaten...
Obviously, they run counter to the intent of the PRODUCTION rules, which is to keep cost down, since it seems like it would be very costly to get the car set up properly to use them, and therefore they should be penalized, or banned outright - a la Saini - down the line.
So I say we give Hayashi a few events (say through Sears) to prove he's a winner, pick up a few extra points to start the season, and then outlaw them.
who says yea to this?
who says nay?
Aaron Bitterman
---------------------------------------------
"Only those who vote really get a say in what goes on."
Douglas,
I am afraid of you, I admit it
. The funny thing about the SQUEALER is he acted like he wasn't going to get caught for squealing. Seems like he got caught pretty easily, the poor little sucker, and I doubt he'll be privy to any more secrets .Also, you're not wrong that, according to the rules, slicks are legal. I just didn't know what slicks were
. I'm rather interested in the experiment myself so I'd say we should let you do what you want with them until you win and then we'll know that they're a major huge unfair advantage .... otherwise, how could you have beaten...Obviously, they run counter to the intent of the PRODUCTION rules, which is to keep cost down, since it seems like it would be very costly to get the car set up properly to use them, and therefore they should be penalized, or banned outright - a la Saini - down the line.
So I say we give Hayashi a few events (say through Sears) to prove he's a winner, pick up a few extra points to start the season, and then outlaw them.
who says yea to this?
who says nay?
Aaron Bitterman
---------------------------------------------
"Only those who vote really get a say in what goes on."
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From: Chicago
Hehe... since your post was so frikkin long, I'm not even gonna try and quote it!
How do I know slicks won't work on a stock suspended (relatively) S2000? Becuase I just know that the more grip your tires generate, the stiffer the springs need to be. Ask any racer. So the more grip you add, the more strange sheeat it's gonna do to the handling.
Framed another way - speed ain't as easy as bolting a set of slicks on the car.
And Re:The King car, I mean lightly modified in the respect that it was all bolt-on stuff, off the shelf, and the motor wasn't touched. You don't have to use Mugen stuff to recreate the lap times we turned... a good set of coilovers, tires, brake pads and front swaybar should get pretty damn close (as in within a second) of the King car if driven properly.
So do I think it's cool to bolt a set of slicks on a stock S2000 and lap quickly? No, because it involved no thought, research (other than the wheel research of how to get the tires to work), testing, knowledge, or suspension savvy. I like cars that go fast because the person tuning them was smart, or the people designing the parts were thorough. Not cars that go fast 'cause you slap a band-aid on them.
That's why I don't really like supercharged cars... I just don't like the whole 'all I need is a ____ and I will be able to kick ass' attitude.
If you can get away with it, Doug, more power to you... but I honestly think that they won't work well on the stock suspended car. Ask Dave!
How do I know slicks won't work on a stock suspended (relatively) S2000? Becuase I just know that the more grip your tires generate, the stiffer the springs need to be. Ask any racer. So the more grip you add, the more strange sheeat it's gonna do to the handling.
Framed another way - speed ain't as easy as bolting a set of slicks on the car.
And Re:The King car, I mean lightly modified in the respect that it was all bolt-on stuff, off the shelf, and the motor wasn't touched. You don't have to use Mugen stuff to recreate the lap times we turned... a good set of coilovers, tires, brake pads and front swaybar should get pretty damn close (as in within a second) of the King car if driven properly.
So do I think it's cool to bolt a set of slicks on a stock S2000 and lap quickly? No, because it involved no thought, research (other than the wheel research of how to get the tires to work), testing, knowledge, or suspension savvy. I like cars that go fast because the person tuning them was smart, or the people designing the parts were thorough. Not cars that go fast 'cause you slap a band-aid on them.
That's why I don't really like supercharged cars... I just don't like the whole 'all I need is a ____ and I will be able to kick ass' attitude.
If you can get away with it, Doug, more power to you... but I honestly think that they won't work well on the stock suspended car. Ask Dave!
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Jason,
But Dave said he picked up like four seconds at Sears. The knuckle broke because it had cracked long ago and rusted out the inside.
Slick Rick,
I don't think we need to mandate specific tires because S02's are the best street tires, RA-1's are the best spec. competition tire (if someone wants to run Kumho's or something else, that's fine), and Hoosiers are too expensive for production. They're apparently more expensive than slicks, according to some. So, I think it's fine the way it is, we just need to figure out what to do about these the slicks question.
dt
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"I'm all about slicks."
But Dave said he picked up like four seconds at Sears. The knuckle broke because it had cracked long ago and rusted out the inside.
Slick Rick,
I don't think we need to mandate specific tires because S02's are the best street tires, RA-1's are the best spec. competition tire (if someone wants to run Kumho's or something else, that's fine), and Hoosiers are too expensive for production. They're apparently more expensive than slicks, according to some. So, I think it's fine the way it is, we just need to figure out what to do about these the slicks question.
dt
----------------------
"I'm all about slicks."
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From: H.B.- Center of Universe
Choices of how to go-fast so you can talk smack about the other drivers:
1. Purchase $26,000 worth of Mugen Parts
OR
2. Purchase $5000 Comptech Supercharger and $2000+ in suspension bits
OR
3. Purchase $2000+ in suspension bits and $2000 in other mods
OR
3. Purchase $1000 worth of slicks to be put on stock S2000
Hummmm.....what would be the most economical for a few track events.....
You guys sound like you think I have a lock on getting slicks for Laguna. There is only a 5% chance that will happen.....I ain't buying rims this week. Like I said, most probably Hoosiers. I don't think we should do any banning until someone actually kicks ass with the slicks in Production. (but what if I whup everyone in Production with my Hoosiers. Do Hoosiers get banned? )
-Doug "If he is fast with it, ban it. Call it the Hayashi Rule" Hayashi
Wanted: Rental 17/18 Rims that fit S2000 to be used for a few days. Will Pay Cash!
1. Purchase $26,000 worth of Mugen Parts
OR
2. Purchase $5000 Comptech Supercharger and $2000+ in suspension bits
OR
3. Purchase $2000+ in suspension bits and $2000 in other mods
OR
3. Purchase $1000 worth of slicks to be put on stock S2000
Hummmm.....what would be the most economical for a few track events.....
You guys sound like you think I have a lock on getting slicks for Laguna. There is only a 5% chance that will happen.....I ain't buying rims this week. Like I said, most probably Hoosiers. I don't think we should do any banning until someone actually kicks ass with the slicks in Production. (but what if I whup everyone in Production with my Hoosiers. Do Hoosiers get banned? )
-Doug "If he is fast with it, ban it. Call it the Hayashi Rule" Hayashi
Wanted: Rental 17/18 Rims that fit S2000 to be used for a few days. Will Pay Cash!
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3. Purchase $1000 worth of slicks to be put on stock S2000
.... and $2000 worth of custom wheels, with many hours of R&D, test fitting for proper offsets, rebuilding, etc. just like Mumford did and just like Keeney did. Unless those offsets get shared that's another $1000 = $3,0000.
But, I'm agreeing with Douglas here. Allow 'em till they're proven to be worth 2 sec. or more over Hoosiers. But if they are, they should get bumped because that's the same reason Hoosiers got bumped.
Bitterman
"Raise the roof for Team Squealer"
.... and $2000 worth of custom wheels, with many hours of R&D, test fitting for proper offsets, rebuilding, etc. just like Mumford did and just like Keeney did. Unless those offsets get shared that's another $1000 = $3,0000.
But, I'm agreeing with Douglas here. Allow 'em till they're proven to be worth 2 sec. or more over Hoosiers. But if they are, they should get bumped because that's the same reason Hoosiers got bumped.
Bitterman
"Raise the roof for Team Squealer"
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From: Chicago
Ya, Ya, Ya... $26k and all that... but JZR, how many of those parts were necessary to get a 1:44?
I can share which ones were necessary:
Coilovers - $3300
Front swaybar - $400
Brake pads - $400
Hoosiers - ya gatta buy tires anyway.
which ones helped the cause:
Hardtop - $2600
Wing - $1300
Intake - $1500
Exhaust - $1500
ECU - $1500
which ones had little to do with lap time:
All the rest of it...
Grand total, $13kish
And in all fairness you could go a different route for coilovers, swaybar, exhaust, and ecu and probably get the same results. So it ain't a Mugen thang, but it's a well prepared car thing. So it isn't all about the cash in the Mugen car, but rather the correct blend of developent. That was my original poor choice of words... A car set up for outright speed, not a show car like the Red one, could challenge for FTD and do it in a relatively reasonably priced manner. That's what I originally meant but failed to say.
I can share which ones were necessary:
Coilovers - $3300
Front swaybar - $400
Brake pads - $400
Hoosiers - ya gatta buy tires anyway.
which ones helped the cause:
Hardtop - $2600
Wing - $1300
Intake - $1500
Exhaust - $1500
ECU - $1500
which ones had little to do with lap time:
All the rest of it...
Grand total, $13kish
And in all fairness you could go a different route for coilovers, swaybar, exhaust, and ecu and probably get the same results. So it ain't a Mugen thang, but it's a well prepared car thing. So it isn't all about the cash in the Mugen car, but rather the correct blend of developent. That was my original poor choice of words... A car set up for outright speed, not a show car like the Red one, could challenge for FTD and do it in a relatively reasonably priced manner. That's what I originally meant but failed to say.
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From: Santa Cruz, CA, US
Daves already proven they are worth more than 2 seconds. It's just bad news when some noob shows up with slicks thinking he can handle them. I'd rather see less s2ks damaged.
I know doug can handle them, but what if someone like with reflexes like fluxen tried them? Talk about trouble.
I know doug can handle them, but what if someone like with reflexes like fluxen tried them? Talk about trouble.