AP1 vs. Sti
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,404
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From: Cape Girardeau
I can't believe the crap I'm reading in this thread, no wonder my friend Fanta was in such hot water here!
Given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, a WRX and an S2000 are a good race from a dig with the edge going to the S2000 (13.8/13.9). However, from a roll, the S2000 should win every time.
Having said that, given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, an S2000 is nowhere near a match for an STi, from a dig, or a roll.
When the modding begins, the odds tip in the Subie's favor in a big way. A basic down-pipe/reflash makes an otherwise stock WRX a low 13-second car that will pull a mildly modded S2000 from a roll, and absolutely kill it from a dig.
A down-pipe/reflash on an STi brings sub 4-second 0-60 times, and mid 12's easily, I mean, the kill would be so bad it's not even worth mentioning.
All I can say is that you guys killing STi's with your little test-pipes are running into folks that just don't know how to drive, and are getting well deserved kills, just remember that you're not killing the car, you're killing the driver.
The last thing I'll mention here is the coefficient of drag. The WRX and STi are basically bricks with air-brakes (hood-scoop/functional spoiler), so their weakness is 100 to 140, and if you want to even the odds a bit, I suggest you start at 100 mph.
For reference, this is a viddy I made back when my STi was bone stock. No effort was made to launch, or shift quickly, I was merely ran the car to the electronic speed-limiter for reference.
Linky
Given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, a WRX and an S2000 are a good race from a dig with the edge going to the S2000 (13.8/13.9). However, from a roll, the S2000 should win every time.
Having said that, given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, an S2000 is nowhere near a match for an STi, from a dig, or a roll.
When the modding begins, the odds tip in the Subie's favor in a big way. A basic down-pipe/reflash makes an otherwise stock WRX a low 13-second car that will pull a mildly modded S2000 from a roll, and absolutely kill it from a dig.
A down-pipe/reflash on an STi brings sub 4-second 0-60 times, and mid 12's easily, I mean, the kill would be so bad it's not even worth mentioning.
All I can say is that you guys killing STi's with your little test-pipes are running into folks that just don't know how to drive, and are getting well deserved kills, just remember that you're not killing the car, you're killing the driver.
The last thing I'll mention here is the coefficient of drag. The WRX and STi are basically bricks with air-brakes (hood-scoop/functional spoiler), so their weakness is 100 to 140, and if you want to even the odds a bit, I suggest you start at 100 mph.
For reference, this is a viddy I made back when my STi was bone stock. No effort was made to launch, or shift quickly, I was merely ran the car to the electronic speed-limiter for reference.
Linky
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 508
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From: Texas
Originally Posted by S2Kguy,Nov 24 2006, 08:07 AM
I can't believe the crap I'm reading in this thread, no wonder my friend Fanta was in such hot water here!
Given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, a WRX and an S2000 are a good race from a dig with the edge going to the S2000 (13.8/13.9). However, from a roll, the S2000 should win every time.
Having said that, given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, an S2000 is nowhere near a match for an STi, from a dig, or a roll.
When the modding begins, the odds tip in the Subie's favor in a big way. A basic down-pipe/reflash makes an otherwise stock WRX a low 13-second car that will pull a mildly modded S2000 from a roll, and absolutely kill it from a dig.
A down-pipe/reflash on an STi brings sub 4-second 0-60 times, and mid 12's easily, I mean, the kill would be so bad it's not even worth mentioning.
All I can say is that you guys killing STi's with your little test-pipes are running into folks that just don't know how to drive, and are getting well deserved kills, just remember that you're not killing the car, you're killing the driver.
The last thing I'll mention here is the coefficient of drag. The WRX and STi are basically bricks with air-brakes (hood-scoop/functional spoiler), so their weakness is 100 to 140, and if you want to even the odds a bit, I suggest you start at 100 mph.
For reference, this is a viddy I made back when my STi was bone stock. No effort was made to launch, or shift quickly, I was merely ran the car to the electronic speed-limiter for reference.
Linky
Given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, a WRX and an S2000 are a good race from a dig with the edge going to the S2000 (13.8/13.9). However, from a roll, the S2000 should win every time.
Having said that, given equal circumstances and equal drivers, stock for stock, an S2000 is nowhere near a match for an STi, from a dig, or a roll.
When the modding begins, the odds tip in the Subie's favor in a big way. A basic down-pipe/reflash makes an otherwise stock WRX a low 13-second car that will pull a mildly modded S2000 from a roll, and absolutely kill it from a dig.
A down-pipe/reflash on an STi brings sub 4-second 0-60 times, and mid 12's easily, I mean, the kill would be so bad it's not even worth mentioning.
All I can say is that you guys killing STi's with your little test-pipes are running into folks that just don't know how to drive, and are getting well deserved kills, just remember that you're not killing the car, you're killing the driver.
The last thing I'll mention here is the coefficient of drag. The WRX and STi are basically bricks with air-brakes (hood-scoop/functional spoiler), so their weakness is 100 to 140, and if you want to even the odds a bit, I suggest you start at 100 mph.
For reference, this is a viddy I made back when my STi was bone stock. No effort was made to launch, or shift quickly, I was merely ran the car to the electronic speed-limiter for reference.
Linky
Yes, many on here think a stock S2000 vs a stock STi is a driver's race. I do not. It is also equally as stupid on your end to post something which belittles all S2000 owners. It doesn't take too many modifications (if done the right way) to compete with a stock STi from a roll... that is a fact, and if you say otherwise, you are in denial.
I grow tired of these comparisons. They are completely different cars made for completely different purposes.
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Bro for all we know that speed run could've been on a dyno. No roads or anything were shown.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,404
Likes: 2
From: Cape Girardeau
Originally Posted by Whitedeon8,Nov 24 2006, 08:25 AM
With our "little test pipes"? Good job of being neutral. And I suppose C6 owners would refer to STi owners as the people with "little downpipes."
Yes, many on here think a stock S2000 vs a stock STi is a driver's race. I do not. It is also equally as stupid on your end to post something which belittles all S2000 owners. It doesn't take too many modifications (if done the right way) to compete with a stock STi from a roll... that is a fact, and if you say otherwise, you are in denial.
I grow tired of these comparisons. They are completely different cars made for completely different purposes.
Yes, many on here think a stock S2000 vs a stock STi is a driver's race. I do not. It is also equally as stupid on your end to post something which belittles all S2000 owners. It doesn't take too many modifications (if done the right way) to compete with a stock STi from a roll... that is a fact, and if you say otherwise, you are in denial.
I grow tired of these comparisons. They are completely different cars made for completely different purposes.
Also, I'm not trying to belittle S2000 owners in any way, I used to be one, I merely stated that killing an STi in an N/A S2000 is killing the driver, not the car, which is true.
"Doesn't take too many modifications to compete with a stock STi from a roll". Short of a SC or TC, you'll lose (with equal circumstances and drivers of course).
I'm not comparing what the cars were meant to do, neither were meant to be
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,335
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From: Overland Park, KS
Originally Posted by blessed,Nov 24 2006, 10:56 AM
Bro for all we know that speed run could've been on a dyno. No roads or anything were shown.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
After owning 3 S2000's and going on my 3rd STi, I stay neutral to both cars. I love them equally for what they can do. The only thing were both cars are similar is in autox performance...add rain to the equation and it does not take a brain surgeon to figure out the outcome.
The s2000 will absolutely kill the STi in looks...feel and fun factor (again, this is subjective) - but yields all to space and convenience of having 4 seats...
A PROPERLY driven STi (04, 05, 06...) off the hole or off the role will spank an AP1 or AP2 S2000 - stock for stock ANY day...
Just becase "a" S2000 driver happens to beat another driver on an STi does NOT make all S2000's faster than an STi...
I think there are a couple of S2000s that beat C5's....please don't even go there...
Why people keep trying to compare lemons and pineapples is beyond me...
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,404
Likes: 2
From: Cape Girardeau
Originally Posted by blessed,Nov 24 2006, 08:56 AM
Bro for all we know that speed run could've been on a dyno. No roads or anything were shown.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
And like I said above...One of my best friends owns an '05 STI...Coming from a regular WRX. When he was stock and unbroken in the race was silly vs basic bolt-on's on my S2000...Once he broke it in and put on a turboback, he was still behind me...and im talking about a good friend here, not just some random encounter on the road where I jumped him or something...numerious numerious times. I dunno, maybe the '05's slower or something.
Linky
I believe everything you're saying, I just think your situation is the exception, not the rule.
Oh, and the '05 produces the same #'s as the '04, 13.3 bone stock (generally).
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,258
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Originally Posted by S2Kguy,Nov 24 2006, 09:22 AM
No problem, several posts of the same nature on streetfire prompted me to post the original video from a few minutes earlier that night, have a look...
Linky
I believe everything you're saying, I just think your situation is the exception, not the rule.
Oh, and the '05 produces the same #'s as the '04, 13.3 bone stock (generally).
Linky
I believe everything you're saying, I just think your situation is the exception, not the rule.
Oh, and the '05 produces the same #'s as the '04, 13.3 bone stock (generally).
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i reced 3 sti lost to one, it was modded but the other ones i pulled on it from a roll (one on the street the other on the freeway) i did race though a heavily modded wrx from a stop and lost by a car which is what he gained from the roll but didnt pull on me. just my experience..
btw my mods include
p&p head
supertech valve train
i/e
img
4.57 gears
and some ground wires
no tuning yet...
btw my mods include
p&p head
supertech valve train
i/e
img
4.57 gears
and some ground wires
no tuning yet...
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 508
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From: Texas
[QUOTE=S2Kguy,Nov 24 2006, 09:13 AM] Forgive me for using the wrong wording, I didn't mean to offend anyone. What I meant was that the test-pipe is a small-gain modification, unlike a down-pipe on a WRX or STi. Not sure why I'm explaining this though, you already know it to be true.
Also, I'm not trying to belittle S2000 owners in any way, I used to be one, I merely stated that killing an STi in an N/A S2000 is killing the driver, not the car, which is true.
"Doesn't take too many modifications to compete with a stock STi from a roll". Short of a SC or TC, you'll lose (with equal circumstances and drivers of course).
I'm not comparing what the cars were meant to do, neither were meant to be
Also, I'm not trying to belittle S2000 owners in any way, I used to be one, I merely stated that killing an STi in an N/A S2000 is killing the driver, not the car, which is true.
"Doesn't take too many modifications to compete with a stock STi from a roll". Short of a SC or TC, you'll lose (with equal circumstances and drivers of course).
I'm not comparing what the cars were meant to do, neither were meant to be
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,404
Likes: 2
From: Cape Girardeau
Originally Posted by Whitedeon8,Nov 24 2006, 12:33 PM
I can respect that. I know there are many who have their S2000 specs on and are blinded as to what is really going on.
You don't even need close to a SC to beat a stock STi from a roll. Slap on some 4.57 gears and you will eventually pull a stock STi no matter what speed roll you start from. Add in decent exhaust work 63-70 mm single, intake, and a tune... all of this with gears will pull a stock STi from any speed roll.
You don't even need close to a SC to beat a stock STi from a roll. Slap on some 4.57 gears and you will eventually pull a stock STi no matter what speed roll you start from. Add in decent exhaust work 63-70 mm single, intake, and a tune... all of this with gears will pull a stock STi from any speed roll.
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