[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mamba
[B]Ok guys, how about a comment from someone with a car from each manufacturer.

 

From what I've seen and heard about the new Z3, it won't come close to the performance specs the S2000 produces. Still not a bad ride though...

 

The point is that the BMW sedan will outhandle most things on the road, civics obviously included. I can embarass 'vette owners by sticking to their rear bumper in the twisties, and watch them drive away in the straights.

My point was the same as yours, the guys further up in the thread were trying to say one was better than the other. They are just different. If you have to have a back seat, the BMW sedan will give you almost the performance the higher end roadsters will. I said almost.

 

First, to the original Q. I think you've received the answer. No one here knows what changes are in store as Honda is always very tight-lipped about this. Anything you see is speculation. FW(little)IW, I doubt there will be much of a change and would certainly not count on one.

Second, on the desire for a "broad flat torque curve". Wouldn't make much difference here. What you really want is a larger amount of torque (note I didn't say just "low rpm" torque). The S2K's curve isn't the flatest due to its pronounced VTEC hump. Even if it were, I doubt a flat 153 +/- 10% across the board would suffice if you are looking for the Z3 3.0's 220+ (nevermind the Vipers 400+). No way any technology is going to make a 2.0L NA engine feel like a high-performance 3.0, 3.2 I6 or 8.0-v10.

Throttle tip-in? You'd feel it if you did it from high-rpm. I'll stay away from the physics this time

Third, on VTEC'ing on a test drive. I can certainly understand why an owner who got a car with 30 mi on it would be nervous and thus biased against someone who VTEC'd on a TD. On the other hand, if I am making at $32K purchase, and the principle selling point of the car is its high-rpm performance, I sure would want to find out if I like it there! I wouldn't just go by some reviewer who is given to hyperbole (no Mr C&D, I do not think it sounds like an F1 car!). Also, and has been posited, I think it is really an open issue as to whether a few seconds of early VTEC really matters. Feel fee to disagree with the above, but please don't assume that your opinion is absolute here.

As to the old "sports car" debate: There is no absolute definition. # of doors, seats, topless or not, weight, hp, performance, yada yada. I like M3's, even old 4-door versions, I like S2000's. Whether one fits someone elses definition of "sports car" is really irrelevant, isn't it?

I-VTEC: By all the numbers, and just a tad of personal experience (TD of an RSX), IMHO this is very incremental, evolutionary change. It isn't all that noticeable in performance. Again, an extra 5 lb-ft of low-end torque (if if even that much) is not going to markedly change the character of the S2000.

 

And that is your choice duh! I think the INFORMATION Mamba provided was useful and formed in a thoughtful way. Go get the Civic to get groceries if you want, if I had a choice of a second car between going to the store in a Civic and a BMW sedan (any will do), I'd pick the Bimmer. And so would any other car person if $ was not object. So lighten up |<|2`/P70N173 life is too short man.

What is with this thread anyway, is there some rule that says you can't like BMW's and Honda's? Only a pea brain would be expected to have this kind of opinion. Gheez, who is trying to prove what to whom here? I would expect such a bitter tone from a Porche forum with a BMW guy, but here I really didn't. I think the BMW engineers have done great things over the years and if ANYONE that loves cars can't admit that, they are not being honest with themselves. I reallize the marketing of BMW are a pit pompous sometimes for my liking, but the engineers don't approve/dis-approve marketing releases. Take it from this engineer, you design the products and marketing positions them. Now that I'm in sales I have to have one foot in each camp, fun sometimes other times not sooo much fun .

Happy new year Honda and BMW owners. As Tiny Tim says: "God bless everyone!"

 

It's silly to compare a Civic to the refinement of a 3 series BMW.

 

[QUOTE][I]Originally posted by

 

This thread should be renamed "Come here to be oversensitive." Thank you FCGuy for your pointed commentary. You've shown what a true "car guy" can bring to the discussion.

Times like this remind me of the famous brand-guy quote, "There's more to a sports car than acceleration and cornering."

We should all be counting our blessings that we have so many good choices other than Accords and Taurus' (which are fine sedans, OK?). Hey, we could be living somewhere where a Trabant is a step up!

 

Thanks FCGuy for the level headed and informative response. I was just curious if anyone had heard about a potential engine upgrade in the near future. It seems not, but given the recent HP race among manufacturers I thought that maybe Honda had something planned. They certainly have the technology advantage over most others.

400+ ft. lbs.??? My Viper has 490 ft. lbs. plus whatever I added with K&N's, smooth intake tubes and Corsa cat-back exhaust. I'm hoping 460+ HP and 500+ torque. Other than that it is just a Dodge... cheap quality.

Yes, why do people get all upset about other makes. I like all performance cars whether they be Suburu WRX, Honda S2000, BMW M's, Mercedes AMG, Porsche, Ferrari, Viper........

Finally, has anyone with an S2000 had an extended drive in a Boxster S? I would like to hear your honest comments and opinions.

 

man....you guys need to chill out. a couple of blips to 9k at low miles is not going to destroy the car...don't believe the hype. Many new cars come with break-ins that are completely optional. The s2000 is probably a little more sensitive, but give me a break. A little time in the high rpm range isn't going to kill the car...sheesh.