Bringing a S2K from Japan into the States
01-31-2001, 10:05 AM
#21
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 630
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Loki et al-
What your friend did, and what you initially posted are two different things- #5 that is.
You stated that you were to disassemble the car, ship the chassis separately from the trans/engine, reassemble in the US and register it as a kit car. That is illegal. There is no grey area there- there is intentional deception that can bite back- and yes, Customs, DOT and EPA work REALLY well together when it comes to these cases.
You then provided an example that your friend bought a USA legal Porsche 911 derivative, and at a similar time bought the trans/engine assembly to a Porsche GT3. Why would he bother buying the Porsche in Europe and shipping it back, except for an European Delivery program to save on a trip to Germany? Once the trans/engine is here, and installed, why does your friend have to re-register the car? There's no need for that. What he should be careful of, is, if he lives in CA, he needs CARB exemption for the engine, which I think is impossible to do. 959 chassis are too different for you to just swap parts out like a GT2, or GT3 with a standard 930/993/996 chassis. 959- why bother? The new Turbo is better than the 959, even if it doesn't have the panache of the 959 name.
Oh- about the McLaren F1 here in the USA- AmeriTech, the company that was importing them prior, doesn't do it anymore. Something to do with misrepresenting themselves as manufacturers to DOT and having NO crash testing compliance data. I would say that DOT will make their lives hard... I heard through the grapevine that there's ONE guy in the country fighting DOT, EPA and Customs over this one- rumored to be a Sun Micro executive. Talk about a lost cause... Rule #1- Never, ever piss the DOT, EPA and Customs off.
Lotus Elises are available in the USA- but only as a track car. Would you drive a car on the track that can't even pass DOT crash tests? I'd have to be paid alot of money...
What your friend did, and what you initially posted are two different things- #5 that is.
You stated that you were to disassemble the car, ship the chassis separately from the trans/engine, reassemble in the US and register it as a kit car. That is illegal. There is no grey area there- there is intentional deception that can bite back- and yes, Customs, DOT and EPA work REALLY well together when it comes to these cases.
You then provided an example that your friend bought a USA legal Porsche 911 derivative, and at a similar time bought the trans/engine assembly to a Porsche GT3. Why would he bother buying the Porsche in Europe and shipping it back, except for an European Delivery program to save on a trip to Germany? Once the trans/engine is here, and installed, why does your friend have to re-register the car? There's no need for that. What he should be careful of, is, if he lives in CA, he needs CARB exemption for the engine, which I think is impossible to do. 959 chassis are too different for you to just swap parts out like a GT2, or GT3 with a standard 930/993/996 chassis. 959- why bother? The new Turbo is better than the 959, even if it doesn't have the panache of the 959 name.
Oh- about the McLaren F1 here in the USA- AmeriTech, the company that was importing them prior, doesn't do it anymore. Something to do with misrepresenting themselves as manufacturers to DOT and having NO crash testing compliance data. I would say that DOT will make their lives hard... I heard through the grapevine that there's ONE guy in the country fighting DOT, EPA and Customs over this one- rumored to be a Sun Micro executive. Talk about a lost cause... Rule #1- Never, ever piss the DOT, EPA and Customs off.
Lotus Elises are available in the USA- but only as a track car. Would you drive a car on the track that can't even pass DOT crash tests? I'd have to be paid alot of money...
01-31-2001, 11:11 AM
#22
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 2,880
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
GTR: I only used the example of the GT3 as the only personal experience I have that's closest to #5, it is not completely #5 but has some of the same logistics. Mind you I have no problem working my way around the DOT, EPA and customs should I ever find myself fortunate to afford an exotic car unavailable in the US but that's a risk I'd take if I could afford it!
I'm unsure what you mean concerning the Euro delivery... let me clarify the situation with the GT3.
This person has already done this once last year and unfortunately a SUV hit his car. He was able to salvage all of or most of the GT3 parts again and ordered a new porsche. When the ordered Porsche *arrived* stateside, he then registered it *once* and started the swap. As for CARB, he's got 4 years to figure out what to do and by that time he'll probably have another car.
Not sure where you got this "travelling to europe" notation but there ya go.
Just got this pic from him:
I'm unsure what you mean concerning the Euro delivery... let me clarify the situation with the GT3.
This person has already done this once last year and unfortunately a SUV hit his car. He was able to salvage all of or most of the GT3 parts again and ordered a new porsche. When the ordered Porsche *arrived* stateside, he then registered it *once* and started the swap. As for CARB, he's got 4 years to figure out what to do and by that time he'll probably have another car.
Not sure where you got this "travelling to europe" notation but there ya go.
Just got this pic from him:
01-31-2001, 03:31 PM
#23
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 630
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Loki-
Your friend ordered a Porsche from a local USA Porsche dealer. That's a far cry from importing the car and registering it yourself.
I've done it the only two ways a USA citizen can legally do it.
I have a '66 Jaguar. It meets the grandfather clause that makes it exempt from BOTH DOT and EPA certification. It was brought from Hong Kong earlier this year and now has Illinois plates. ALL LEGAL, no hassles, no backdoor BS.
I have a '92 Nissan GT-R. My friends did the DOT and EPA certification, and I gave them money to certify my particular car. It is DOT and EPA compliant, and I have the documents to prove it. It is the most powerful USA DOT and EPA raod legal GT-R.
Doing what you suggest is still not legal and definitely NOT ethical. The engine your friend is using in his car is not USA DOT and EPA legal. Don't let anyone know he has this in his car (stop telling everyone!)- if the wrong people find out, the car will meet a quick demise at the hands of the EPA, whose laws he most definitely is breaking. That motor is not EPA compliant. You say your friend has four years to figure it out- I say he has four years before they actually force him to give himself up or swap a EPA compliant engine back in.
Evading the law is not the same as complying with the law. Murderers can get away with murder, but that doesn't make it legal or right. And you will have whistle blowers on your backside if you try to pull such a scam off- it's just a matter of when- even bigger companies like AmeriTech get caught.
The reason why I thought you were talking about European Delivery Program- Your words...
<<) Dissassemble the engine transmission and body, ship them all over independently and reassemble stateside clearing customs independently. Register as a kit car. (this is partially how a friend of mine will have a Porsche GT3) >>
<<In actuality my friend ordered a normal 911 (just shipped over) and had the engine and tranny of a GT3 brought over along with all the special interior/exterior bits that make that model unique>>
I think you were implying very heavily that that was the course of action. You did not say that the car your friend bought was a USA model, purchased at a USA dealership.
Conforming to USA Goverment requirements to register a car is not impossible. It's just very, very hard, and very, very expensive. If someone else isn't footing a majority of the bill it just isn't worth it. It's harder than you make it out to be. In fact, I know it's harder than I make it out to be.
[Edited by GTRPower on 01-31-2001 at 04:42 PM]
Your friend ordered a Porsche from a local USA Porsche dealer. That's a far cry from importing the car and registering it yourself.
I've done it the only two ways a USA citizen can legally do it.
I have a '66 Jaguar. It meets the grandfather clause that makes it exempt from BOTH DOT and EPA certification. It was brought from Hong Kong earlier this year and now has Illinois plates. ALL LEGAL, no hassles, no backdoor BS.
I have a '92 Nissan GT-R. My friends did the DOT and EPA certification, and I gave them money to certify my particular car. It is DOT and EPA compliant, and I have the documents to prove it. It is the most powerful USA DOT and EPA raod legal GT-R.
Doing what you suggest is still not legal and definitely NOT ethical. The engine your friend is using in his car is not USA DOT and EPA legal. Don't let anyone know he has this in his car (stop telling everyone!)- if the wrong people find out, the car will meet a quick demise at the hands of the EPA, whose laws he most definitely is breaking. That motor is not EPA compliant. You say your friend has four years to figure it out- I say he has four years before they actually force him to give himself up or swap a EPA compliant engine back in.
Evading the law is not the same as complying with the law. Murderers can get away with murder, but that doesn't make it legal or right. And you will have whistle blowers on your backside if you try to pull such a scam off- it's just a matter of when- even bigger companies like AmeriTech get caught.
The reason why I thought you were talking about European Delivery Program- Your words...
<<) Dissassemble the engine transmission and body, ship them all over independently and reassemble stateside clearing customs independently. Register as a kit car. (this is partially how a friend of mine will have a Porsche GT3) >>
<<In actuality my friend ordered a normal 911 (just shipped over) and had the engine and tranny of a GT3 brought over along with all the special interior/exterior bits that make that model unique>>
I think you were implying very heavily that that was the course of action. You did not say that the car your friend bought was a USA model, purchased at a USA dealership.
Conforming to USA Goverment requirements to register a car is not impossible. It's just very, very hard, and very, very expensive. If someone else isn't footing a majority of the bill it just isn't worth it. It's harder than you make it out to be. In fact, I know it's harder than I make it out to be.
[Edited by GTRPower on 01-31-2001 at 04:42 PM]
01-31-2001, 03:50 PM
#24
I meant to post this earlier in the thread, but didn't. Here are three links that are useful to this thread:
http://www.customs.ustreas.gov/imp-exp2/in...nformal/car.htm
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/import/
http://www.epa.gov/otaq/
http://www.customs.ustreas.gov/imp-exp2/in...nformal/car.htm
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/import/
http://www.epa.gov/otaq/
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post