I don't mind deleting the smack talk posts.

It's not like uncle sam owns this board...

Someone else does... and he /she can do whatever they want...

SO...it's not really a public board... :-)

The thought of a 'public board' is what gives these posters the desire to smack talk.

Now amongst paid members, well perhaps there should be appended post rules against the talk of "ap1" vs "ap2". They would then get a reprimand and a post deletion.

All the rest just get deleted or banned :-)


"AP1 is better dude! And screw you, you don't know what your talking about. It's a public board, so free speach man! I can say whatever i feel." <-- getting sick of this too.

 

I don't get into the whole AP1 vs AP2 threads because they simply don't interest me, but you've asked. I have an AP2 which I am quite fond of, I bought as a "fun car" only. I do understand the history of the AP1 and the reasons for the changes to the AP2, but a lot of what you stated in the OP still comes over as "the AP1 is the original and the AP2 isn't" thus equalling AP1 is better than the AP2. It is really irrelevant IMO. As someone else mentioned above, it's like the 911 guys understand all the different versions of the car, but the certain few that claim it isn't a 911 unless it is air cooled, it's all BS.
I don't know about anyone else, but the sides of my car quite clearly state "S2000" and that's all that matters, to me, at the end of the day.

Sam

 

[QUOTE=00CivicSi,May 18 2007, 08:21 AM]


Additionally, here's my personal perspective:
I've driven both and I've experienced the differences.

 

[QUOTE=sw05s2k,May 18 2007, 03:26 PM]I don't get into the whole AP1 vs AP2 threads because they simply don't interest me, but you've asked.

 

You're right. S2kI isn't really a public forum, but from what I know of the owners and moderators I believe that their goal (or at least one of their goals) is to provide a fun and *informative* place for S2000 owners to get together, have a good time, and exchange information. One of the neat things about the S2000 is it's history and evolution, and it would be a shame to ban discussions of the things we like about our particular version of the S2000. Seems to me that if we have to solve this through censorship we have to ban any mention of any differences between MY cars. Nobody should be allowed to say anything about the redline of their car, lest someone else get offended. Nobody sould be able to even use the word "torque," lest it start a wanker debate. I don't think the solution is censorship. The only thing that will solve this kind of thing is clear, unbiased communication and open discussion, which is what I'm trying to maintain in this thread.

I'm going to ask you to do the same thing I'm asking so many others to do. If you have the time how about reviewing my opening post and pointing out anything you feel might be mistaken for a put down of either engine (or chassis/MY).

Thanks!

 

You know what we should stop banning is the usage of the 9k rev limiter is better than the 8k rev limiter jpg in the signature. It helps cultivate this "thing" you despise so much.

 

I'll give it a shot...you asked! It is VERY LONG!!!!!

Quote - The owners who deny the advantages of the F22C are no more well informed than the F22C owners who totally fail to understand the F20C. Ignorance is not in short supply on either side of the debate and it's time to set the record straight and stop all the smack talking.

Me - From what I see, it is usually AP1 owners that somehow feel they must defend the AP1. With such things as sigs with graphics of AP1>AP2 pics (depicting part of a males anatomy). I rarely see sigs from AP2 owners with the same type of animosity, at least it comes across that way.

Quote - The F20C was unique for a production engine in a number of ways, but the things that made it, and the S2000 so special most certainly included the high specific output and high redline. Damn it guys, how can any of you be so stupid as to fail to see the attraction of the original car, especially if you look at it from the perspective of the year 2000. If you can't, definately consider a cat scan.

Me -The Honda S800 also had a very high redline 8000rpm for 1965 (and somewhat decent hp) that is impressive to me. The fact that Honda could only muster an additional 1000rpm after 35 years is what I find a little puzzling. But yes, the output per liter for the AP1 is/was impressive.

Quote - I can't for the life of me understand why someone with an F22C powered car would not be PROUD of that heritage, but we see it all the time. Consider a cat scan.

Me - Because of comments made by you, how different the AP2 is, how can an AP2 owner be proud? It isn't the same car as you state, it is "watered-down" (softer suspension, lower redline, "slightly simpler design").

Quote - If you prefer the F20C and you can't grasp the advantages of the F22C then you just need to either show that the advantages don't exist or STFU. If you prefer the F22C and can't grasp what it is that makes the F20C so special, then you need to do the same.

Me - You start off your OP stating that your "mad as hell" and tired of all the arguments. Guess what, you've inadvertantly just started another one! Saying things like, "Personally I don't give a rats butt which engine makes more power or is more advanced, becuase my car isn't in the same race. The performance of YOUR stock S2000 is really of no interest to me, and if you're a good enough driver you can out run most of the people who post on S2kI, including myself. All I care about is putting and end to, or eleminating, as much of the smack talking on both sides of the table as I possibly can. The owners who deny the advantages of the F22C are no more well informed than the F22C owners who totally fail to understand the F20C. Ignorance is not in short supply on either side of the debate and it's time to set the record straight and stop all the smack talking." Is how you should have ended this post, but you didn't.
Like I said before, I don't care what version anyone has, as long as they appreciate the car for what it is.
As you stated, "the recent thread with all the smack talking about the F20C and F22C is little more than a collection of garbage that we'd be better off without, and the argument will continue for as long as there are people who are ignorant about the history of their car."

Sam

 

Who cares?

If you think the world is suddenly going to shift on its axis and we are all going to agree and/or have the same perspective, please make sure there is a stopping point on this axis shift, because I will elect to get off.

I cannot think of a more boring world than one in which we all agree... Variety is the spice of life, stop trying to control what others think, learn to go with the flow and respect other people's opinions.

 

When I bought my AP1 a little more than a year ago I made sure to do all the research I could. Internet, dealerships, magazines, friends, etc. and after the 3 months I spent looking I had more problems picking what color I wanted than I did picking between AP1 and AP2. There was no need for me to start a new topic, I didn't even post until after I had the car, it just wasn't neccesary everything had already been discussed to great lengths here and on other S2000 websites. All the information that I had gotten from S2KI was obtained through the dreaded search function. Honestly, I had no problems using it to find what I was looking for and some things I didn't know I was looking for (diff issues). AP1 had the F20 with the higher redline and AP2 with the larger F22 had more useable torque. The AP2 had the revised suspension to fix some of the high speed instability the AP1 has. Ultimately there was nothing between the two versions for me, the only thing I knew I wanted was an 02+ in Sebring Silver and a warranty. The only reason I wanted an 02+ was for the glass back window. I tried everything out there the old fashioned way, in person, and bought the first one that fit my tastes. You can only pick up so much from an internet forum. If you are contemplating the decision between AP1 and AP2, drive them both and decide for yourself. YOU may be the only unbiased party that can decide what YOU want.

 

Guys,
We all just need to sit back and relax. The S on the outside is still an S. The S on the inside is still an S, so why don't we just leave it at that. I for one don't give a rats ass about AP1 or AP2.

This is one of the finest sports cars I have ever owned and in my 54 years I have owned and driven some of the finest and fastest cars in the world. I have driven in SCCA events as well as and I am dating myself IMSA. I was fortunate enough to have been one of a 3 man driving team, driving a Porshe 959 at the 24hour race in Daytona in the late 80s and early 90sas well as racing at Watkins Glenn, Road America, Road Atlanta among others. In my humble opinion the 2000-2007 Honda S2000 is one of the purest forms of sports cars made in the past 20 years.

This is not a drag car it is a car designed and built to be run on road courses or windy back country roads. Most of all it is a car that needs to be driven for fun and enjoyment. With that being said, I wish all of you who are bitching about which engine is better or worse or which version of the car is better or worse just quit with the negitive postings and just go out drive your car and enjoy it. I hope that the BS will soon stop.