as the years roll by, acceleration stays the same
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From: Covington WA, USA
Originally Posted by __redruM,Sep 6 2007, 01:09 PM
It keeps me interested in the S2000 brand.
If Honda comes out with an improved S2000, that will move "the S2000 brand" higher up in the great pecking order of cars, and thus the reflected glory will shine upon your car? And more importantly, you?
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Amen brother!
It's getting really hard to find cars as light as the S2000.
Whenever I test drive other cars, they may be fast... but nowhere near as fun.
It really does depend on what you want out of a car.
Originally Posted by Edmunds.com
But this is one Ferrari that's been stripped for a grander purpose than Midnight Auto Supply. Weighing in at 2,976 pounds, the Ferrari F430 Scuderia is about 220 pounds lighter than its conventional F430 stablemate, and that's because it's aimed at the track-ready market.
Whenever I test drive other cars, they may be fast... but nowhere near as fun.
It really does depend on what you want out of a car.
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From: Alpharetta, GA (ATL)
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Sep 6 2007, 04:16 PM
I think you may be overlooking a few things. We don't all like or want the same things, so we don't all agree on what constitutes an advancement (or improvement). The S500 was a bit primitive, but I've driven an S800, and it's an amazing little car. In comparison the S2000 feels way too big, and quite literally massive. The S800 has some virtues the S2000 could never have, and offers a driving experience that is at least as unique and enjoyable. The S2000 isn't a watered down version, but it's certainly weighted down. All else being equal, extra weight in a roadster is not an improvement, so at least in one important respect the S800 comes out on top. 
Clearly, your idea of an advancement or improvement and mine are somewhat different, but for you to conclude that this means that I don't believe in advancement is simply wrong. Honda started out with the MY00 cars, and I started out with an MY00 car. Over the years, Honda has made changes to the cars they produce, and I have made changes to the car I own. Compare what I have done to the car to what Honda has done to the car. My car is quicker, faster, grippier, and more responsive. It has superior shift feel and a more positive acting LSD. It has more torque and power while retaining the original 9k redline. The reasons Honda went a totally different route should be obvious. They are catering to a market segment, while I'm free to cater to myself. Almost everything can be improved and made more suitable to a particular user, and there will never be a production car that will be exactly what I want it to be, so I have to do my own upgrades and improvements to make the car what I want it to be. No car company would ever sell a car like mine to the general public, but it suits me perfectly, not because I reject changes, but because I know what I want from a car, and I know how to get it. Just because my prefereces aren't the same as your's does not translate into my rejecting advancements, any more than your failure to modify your car extensively translates into you being satisfied with less. It may seem that way if you look at it from some tilted perspective, but that's clearly not the reality of the situation.
I don't know many cars on the road that are "worse" their their predecessor. Many people may complain about the changes, but at the end of the day, the car is an improvement over the previous.
Just because I believe that the S2000 needs a model change doesn't mean I believe that Honda should stray away from the basic pholosophy of what the car is suppose to be. All a model change is, is giving designers the opportunity to take the same basic concept and take advantage of the advances in technology to make a better machine using improved materials, etc. A good example of this is BMW making the V8 engine in the new M3 30 lbs lighter than the I6 that was in the E46 M3. When I was on the M3 forum, people were complaining about the idea of putting a V8 in the E46 because of weight, however, BMW silenced their noise. Do people over there still complain? Of course, but we all know that the new M3 is a better car... period.
Also, if you take a look at all of the S2000's competitors, they have all evolved since Fall 1999. And all of them have improved vastly. The Z4 is head and shoulders above the Z3. The Boxster is an awesome ride, the TT is finally recognized and the Miata has made some real advancements.
In fact, before I bought my 2nd S2000 I tested 3 cars. The 2004 S2000, a 2006 Mazdaspeed Miata and a 2007 Miata 6 speed. You wouldn't believe the difference that the new Miata had over the 2006 Mazdaspeed Miata. It was a totally difference experience. The car handled so much better. In fact, the 2007 Miata handles better than the S2000 by a long shot. The Mazdaspeed is about equal, but there is a considerable difference between the two.
And this is what I'm talking about. We as S2000 lovers and missing out on the opportunity to see "real" improvements that Honda could be making to the S2000. If Honda went back to the drawing board and started with a clean slate in 2007, think about what they could really do with the roadster concept. Changing a little here and a little there is not the same as giving us an entirely new model where basically EVERYTHING is an improvement.
I mean, where would our society be if we were this complacent about everything in our lives?
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Originally Posted by nastinupe1,Sep 6 2007, 06:02 PM
I believe that you're also missing my point
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the new sky red line costs more than i spent for my new s, and its slower. i test drove one, and i absolutely couldn't stand it, though i liked the look of it. it has awful turbo lag, an awful engine note, and doesnt feel stable like the s does. its still the best car in its price range, IMO!
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From: Alpharetta, GA (ATL)
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Sep 6 2007, 08:25 PM
Mike is right. Just because I don't agree with you does not mean that I have missed the point you're trying to make. I just happen to think that you're wrong. For one thing, you are assuming that I haven't tried other cars, specifically newer S2000's, and that's an invalid assumption. I get the point, but since (as stated above) it is based on an invalid assumption, I don't agree with it.
A better question might be, "Where would we be if everyone thought those who did not share their preferences were complacent about everything in our lives?" To me, that kind of thinking seems very wrong. Please explain how the fact that I prefer different things than you makes me complacent. Personally, I think that's just
.
FWIW, I respect your opinions, but some of your conclusions simply don't follow. No argument about the need for model upgrades; That's a matter of opinion, not fact. It's the judgements you are making against others that are so wrong (and that is a matter of fact).
A better question might be, "Where would we be if everyone thought those who did not share their preferences were complacent about everything in our lives?" To me, that kind of thinking seems very wrong. Please explain how the fact that I prefer different things than you makes me complacent. Personally, I think that's just
.FWIW, I respect your opinions, but some of your conclusions simply don't follow. No argument about the need for model upgrades; That's a matter of opinion, not fact. It's the judgements you are making against others that are so wrong (and that is a matter of fact).
Whether or not we all agree with the direction that Honda decides to go with a model change is irrelevant. What is relevant is that Honda should make the model change regardless or our opinions and preferences and attempt to advance the roadster concept to the next generation.
If we don't like it then we can keep our current rides.
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I absolutely agree that Honda should have made improvements to the S2000 over the years. I had an 03 AP1 and when I went looking for a newer upgrade I found there wasn't really much of a difference at all in an 07 AP2. I ended up getting a Z4....but obviously I am still interested in S2ks or I wouldn't still be on this board. I'm hoping they make advancements so I can come back to the S but it isn't looking good.
