Clio 197
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 31,181
Likes: 58
From: Hertford
Indeed; as I stated earler, there is a fair probability that you might get a reliable one & if you don't mind breakdowns...
Likewise with PSA products; I cannot understand why anyone would want to buy a Picasso, but some have had very good service from them. Others haven't.
The point is, Warranty Direct has a far more accurate sample space than the experience of one, which is not statistically significant.
But I suspect most buyers don't actually get that far and don't buy them with properly open eyes.
I realise the Renaultsport models are supposed to be a cracking drive (the old flimsy 5GTs were) but I still cannot understand the sales of 'cooking' models at all. That also applies to all of the brands with a failure rate of around 70%.
Nearly as mental as buying a MINGY. But at least that's British and is thus maintaining a tradition of crap reliability and leaky engines.
When you could have a nice, reliable Yaris. Oh hang on...
Likewise with PSA products; I cannot understand why anyone would want to buy a Picasso, but some have had very good service from them. Others haven't.
The point is, Warranty Direct has a far more accurate sample space than the experience of one, which is not statistically significant.
But I suspect most buyers don't actually get that far and don't buy them with properly open eyes.
I realise the Renaultsport models are supposed to be a cracking drive (the old flimsy 5GTs were) but I still cannot understand the sales of 'cooking' models at all. That also applies to all of the brands with a failure rate of around 70%.
Nearly as mental as buying a MINGY. But at least that's British and is thus maintaining a tradition of crap reliability and leaky engines.
When you could have a nice, reliable Yaris. Oh hang on...
Registered User
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 787
Likes: 0
From: North Wales
Not a 197, but I had a 2001 172 for 4 years and 50k (got rid in April for my S). Went through a few shock absorbers (£50 each) and a driveshaft (£120), other than that really reliable for me. I'd have another RS personally, I did start off looking at Megane 225's.
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 23,297
Likes: 831
From: Nottingham
The mini is Marmite inside and ultimately a marketing car. Isn't the older one the only actually good un though? Might be an idea.
I tried to get my mum to buy a Suzuki but she bought a splash or something instead of the good un. Get an Alfa GTA and worry about it when it breaks down
I tried to get my mum to buy a Suzuki but she bought a splash or something instead of the good un. Get an Alfa GTA and worry about it when it breaks down
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 31,181
Likes: 58
From: Hertford
The early R56 is the one where the problems started really badly; they replaced the old Chrysler engine with a development of the ancient PSA TU engine (104 anyone?) with valvetronic and the earlier bore/stroke/moving bits. The TC tensioner fails early on with disastrous consequences. HVAC units leak plus they have the usual FRED issues and other silly things. Bloody nightmares, some of them.
The Swift is far more Toyota-like, but without the boredom.
Banned
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 31,739
Likes: 69
From: Survivalist enclave
Originally Posted by Nick Graves' timestamp='1343382320' post='21893079
Honestly, I have a prejudice that Reno buyers obviously know f uck all & did no research before buying one and thus deserve to get stung.
If we all relied solely on 'research', then no-one would ever buy an S2000 either because, in various reports and forum threads they're described as too peaky, the lack of torque renders them undriveable, the steering is numb, the alignment is ceased solid at the wrong settings and anyone that drives one dies a horrible death when it spins on the motorway for no apparent reason.
Renaultsport cars are renowned for their handling and my experience was that the reputation is well deserved. Indeed, many experts rate the design of the suspension set-ups of RS cars. That was my criteria for purchasing the 182, even though I knew I was taking the usual French car risk. Apart from the exhaust, it was generally reliable, so, I felt happy to buy the R26 and DCi Megans, both of which were well rated by the press for performance and economy respectively.
Unfortunately, the Megans proved to be properly French, and the newer 197 is more akin to the Megane build and design-wise than the old model 182.
So, to answer your point, not everyone that has a different opinion to you, Nick, is an ignorant idiot. But that's the beauty of opinions, you can still have one even when it's offensive and only partially accurate. I did my research and bought what appeared to be best for someone who is very much into cars and driving but, at the time, needed practicality as well. I hedged my bets by buying cars with manufacturer's warranty, so apart from inconvenience, I didn't get the stinging I apparently "deserve" for my stupidity. However, if Chris is thinking of buying anything 3 years old or more (I'm not sure when the 197 was replaced by the 200), he won't have that benefit so hopefully my feedback, which is based on actual experience and not anecdotes, will be of use, unlike random insults.
Chris - sorry for the thread hijack.
sometimes the truth stings, if not the ownership experience
the fact is, if you buy a (sporting) Renault you should have a very much greater expectation of problems than if you buy, say, a Honda (S2000)
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,445
Likes: 7
From: Plymouth
But presumably if buying an RS model, then the expectation is not of a highly reliable, economical daily driver anyhow.
Even though they appear to be all those things to a great many owners.
What has surprised both I and my wife is the attention the little Megane receives.
People are regularly nosing over it in carparks.
Quite odd, and I don't think either of us consider its design to be 'special' in the way the S2k was.
There are definatley a lot less of them about than S2K, I see two or three a day around here now. We both have yet to see another RS250.
Perhaps thats it - it's just different.
Or maybe like UF suggests, the reputation Renault Sports have as being fairly focused drivers cars is widespread - even today.
Anyhow, nothing has fallen off yet (although it's early days).
Combined average with lots of commutes and high speed runs is over 30mpg.
Insurance is stupidly cheap, £350pa for both of us versus £700 on the 335i and more for the Honda.
VED is decent and not upper groups.
Its bloody quick - over 300bhp with software only.
Around corners - just try and keep up.
So far so good.
I enjoyed the R26 a lot and did miss its combination of cheap fun and practicality. It wasnt bad on a track either.
But the new iteration is, on paper at least, more rapid than the cult R26.r on a circuit.
And having been in them a few times it seems to be the case.
Funny thing is it STILL uses a real old school rear torsion beam, but it obviously works!
Not owned the Clio myself, but hammered around a track with plenty.
A stripped out 182 punches well above its weight on track, even with a clumsy driver.
Even though they appear to be all those things to a great many owners.
What has surprised both I and my wife is the attention the little Megane receives.
People are regularly nosing over it in carparks.
Quite odd, and I don't think either of us consider its design to be 'special' in the way the S2k was.
There are definatley a lot less of them about than S2K, I see two or three a day around here now. We both have yet to see another RS250.
Perhaps thats it - it's just different.
Or maybe like UF suggests, the reputation Renault Sports have as being fairly focused drivers cars is widespread - even today.
Anyhow, nothing has fallen off yet (although it's early days).
Combined average with lots of commutes and high speed runs is over 30mpg.
Insurance is stupidly cheap, £350pa for both of us versus £700 on the 335i and more for the Honda.
VED is decent and not upper groups.
Its bloody quick - over 300bhp with software only.
Around corners - just try and keep up.
So far so good.
I enjoyed the R26 a lot and did miss its combination of cheap fun and practicality. It wasnt bad on a track either.
But the new iteration is, on paper at least, more rapid than the cult R26.r on a circuit.
And having been in them a few times it seems to be the case.
Funny thing is it STILL uses a real old school rear torsion beam, but it obviously works!
Not owned the Clio myself, but hammered around a track with plenty.
A stripped out 182 punches well above its weight on track, even with a clumsy driver.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,085
Likes: 35
From: Bruges
Originally Posted by Nick Graves' timestamp='1343382320' post='21893079
Honestly, I have a prejudice that Reno buyers obviously know f uck all & did no research before buying one and thus deserve to get stung.
If we all relied solely on 'research', then no-one would ever buy an S2000 either because, in various reports and forum threads they're described as too peaky, the lack of torque renders them undriveable, the steering is numb, the alignment is ceased solid at the wrong settings and anyone that drives one dies a horrible death when it spins on the motorway for no apparent reason.
Renaultsport cars are renowned for their handling and my experience was that the reputation is well deserved. Indeed, many experts rate the design of the suspension set-ups of RS cars. That was my criteria for purchasing the 182, even though I knew I was taking the usual French car risk. Apart from the exhaust, it was generally reliable, so, I felt happy to buy the R26 and DCi Megans, both of which were well rated by the press for performance and economy respectively.
Unfortunately, the Megans proved to be properly French, and the newer 197 is more akin to the Megane build and design-wise than the old model 182.
So, to answer your point, not everyone that has a different opinion to you, Nick, is an ignorant idiot. But that's the beauty of opinions, you can still have one even when it's offensive and only partially accurate. I did my research and bought what appeared to be best for someone who is very much into cars and driving but, at the time, needed practicality as well. I hedged my bets by buying cars with manufacturer's warranty, so apart from inconvenience, I didn't get the stinging I apparently "deserve" for my stupidity. However, if Chris is thinking of buying anything 3 years old or more (I'm not sure when the 197 was replaced by the 200), he won't have that benefit so hopefully my feedback, which is based on actual experience and not anecdotes, will be of use, unlike random insults.
Chris - sorry for the thread hijack.
Well it's French so in NO way can it be ANY good ! capisci ?