Using the RSX wideband with the Kpro
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From: Long Beach, CA
Seems that any signal that Kpro reads should be displayed through an OBD 2 interface
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Originally Posted by RAIN H8R' timestamp='1316037243' post='20973666
Does anyone know if the K-pro 3 being released will allow an OBD scanner to monitor the additional 8 inputs? Say for example I can use a obd scanner to read fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temp sensor and ect. ?
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: Waukesha, WI
Originally Posted by Kyushin' timestamp='1316309284' post='20982925
[quote name='RAIN H8R' timestamp='1316037243' post='20973666']
Does anyone know if the K-pro 3 being released will allow an OBD scanner to monitor the additional 8 inputs? Say for example I can use a obd scanner to read fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temp sensor and ect. ?
Does anyone know if the K-pro 3 being released will allow an OBD scanner to monitor the additional 8 inputs? Say for example I can use a obd scanner to read fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temp sensor and ect. ?
[/quote]
thats what I am thinking. I wanted to do the update to 3, and run a PLX Kiwi bluetooth on my cell phone....
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OK, I think I got it using the SSR relay that freezingcoffee had purchased... I don't have my ECU to test it, so it either works or it doesn't. I am going off of the scematic from the hella site showing how the SSR relay works. http://cat.hella.com/hella-nafta/jsp...87&language=en
Basically, the change is the SSR relay switches the high side of the load (it's used in lights) where the OEM wiring switches the low or ground side- just like most circuts in Honda cars. So, what is needed is to move the realy to the high side of the O2 heater, and used the ECU ground switch output (D8) to turn the relay on and off.
Some notes:
Obvoiusly, I can't be resposible for anyone's ECU, so do this at your own risk... I'd try mine first, but it's still out
PLEASE NOTE CONNECTIONS (85) and (86) one the Hella relay- it does make a difference!
**edited pic to reflect orientation of pins on actual relay**
Basically, the change is the SSR relay switches the high side of the load (it's used in lights) where the OEM wiring switches the low or ground side- just like most circuts in Honda cars. So, what is needed is to move the realy to the high side of the O2 heater, and used the ECU ground switch output (D8) to turn the relay on and off.
Some notes:
- D8 is a SSR ground output itself, switching several times a second
- The Hella relay is NOT a typical automotive relay! DO NOT USE a normal relay in it's place!
- There are two differen versions of the relay, I could not figure out the difference between them. On Hella's web site, they had the exact same wiring diagram, so they could be interchangable. They are avalible at amazon.com for $20 http://www.amazon.com/HELLA-93177398...8452973&sr=8-1 the part numbers are 931773987 and H41773001 http://cat.hella.com/hella-nafta/jsp...sp?nologin=yes
- The ground from (85) on the Hella relay *may* need to be connected to the ECU ground for the relay to work. The relay operates by switching the ground at (86). This must be the same ground at (85)
- The O2 sensor (4) terminal should be connected to a common/good ground point to prevent a ground loop from occuring
- The O2 sensor heater will be NOT be HOT with ignition on, but will operate when the ECU (pin D8) is grounded
Obvoiusly, I can't be resposible for anyone's ECU, so do this at your own risk... I'd try mine first, but it's still out
PLEASE NOTE CONNECTIONS (85) and (86) one the Hella relay- it does make a difference!
**edited pic to reflect orientation of pins on actual relay**
Ok so bear with me here im trying to make sense of this most recent wiring schematic and how exactly its even operating the heater circuit. If you notice the solid state relay is powered through pin 30, then the coil engages with 86.... which routes (according to the diagram) 87 to 85 completing a SECOND ground circuit to an 02 heater circuit which clearly needs a power AND ground. So my question is this, how is the heater even turning on? I can assume that yes the sensor is working and that the board is not frying because there is technically no load at all in this case. You may see a functioning sensor but not a heater.... unless someone can slap some sense into me otherwise I believe clearly we need a power to the other side of the heater. Jumping D8-A1 would apparently eliminate the hassle, but we could also run a fused power on ignition to the heater power side. Or for that matter, run a second power by splitting from the power supplied to pin 30.
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From: Dela-ware?
If you notice the solid state relay is powered through pin 30, then the coil engages with 86.... which routes (according to the diagram) 87 to 85 completing a SECOND ground circuit to an 02 heater circuit which clearly needs a power AND ground. So my question is this, how is the heater even turning on? I can assume that yes the sensor is working and that the board is not frying because there is technically no load at all in this case. You may see a functioning sensor but not a heater.... unless someone can slap some sense into me otherwise I believe clearly we need a power to the other side of the heater. Jumping D8-A1 would apparently eliminate the hassle, but we could also run a fused power on ignition to the heater power side. Or for that matter, run a second power by splitting from the power supplied to pin 30.
It is a Solid State Relay, meaning it uses a transistor to switch current on and off. The power for the transistor is provided by the input at 30 (and reference ground at 85). Switching the ground at (86) ALLOWS the CURRENT to flow through the transistor gate out to 87.
The reason this type of relay is need is because the heater is not on or off, rather it switches on and off serval times a second depending on the load required (SSR heater control), just like a fuel injector.
Providing power straight to the heater will work- BUT it was designed like this for a reason, most likely that the heater+exhaust gas will cause the heater/sensor to run too hot when the engine is at full operating temp, shortening its life (guess on my part). I cannot say for sho what will happen...
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Well allow me to eat these words as my initial view of the relay schematic on rallylights.com had me questioning. When i saw the 3 grounds and the one on the right (pin 87) going to the load and the ground symbol over there i was assuming this to complete a ground to the 02 sensor... but rather this is showing that we are completing power to the load and the other side of the load is grounded. MY BAD! Im actually not the owner of this account but his friend and an auto tech by trade. I did all of the work with him and just wanted to make sure what he was doing makes sense. The only other thing i question is that i believe off of memory that when i looked at the oem wiring diagram for the RSX ecu it showed the wideband being controlled on and off by a supplied ground reference switching signal output. I understand D8 is utilizing this ground output, but we are kind of reversing the way it use to work. Instead of running a power to the sensor and switching a ground we are running a ground to the sensor and essentially switching power with the solid state relay and D8's signal. I would assume no harm in this... but something tells me that there is a reason that every oem car maker that i have ever worked on always switches ground to sensors and not power. Otherwise i agree with the wiring setup now that its been clarified. everything looks bulletproof as far as the restrictions of hondatas daughter board that ive seen posted on here. its clear we arent drawing any large amp load anymore by just switching on and off a solid state relay! I would still like to entertain my curiosity as to why though this is normally a switched ground and not power! I may research that a bit more just in case before we attempt any harness making.
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From: Dat Sac, CA :D
Originally Posted by jaundice' timestamp='1315955240' post='20970380
Well this is new. They finally gave us some input on how to wire an RSX wideband to the KPro...
This is an excerpt from DFWS2K thread on the Hondata forum.
At no point was wideband input to the KPro/S2000 ever supported by Hondata - the only thing that was done was that the adapter board had some tracks for a RSX wideband sensor. If you want a wideband, then for less than $200 wire in a PLX, AEM, Innovate or NGK. If you really, really want to use a RSX sensor, unsupported, then jumper RSX A1 to S2000 E8 so that a o2 sensor heater over-current condition does not damage the adapter board.
This is an excerpt from DFWS2K thread on the Hondata forum.
At no point was wideband input to the KPro/S2000 ever supported by Hondata - the only thing that was done was that the adapter board had some tracks for a RSX wideband sensor. If you want a wideband, then for less than $200 wire in a PLX, AEM, Innovate or NGK. If you really, really want to use a RSX sensor, unsupported, then jumper RSX A1 to S2000 E8 so that a o2 sensor heater over-current condition does not damage the adapter board.
So just to clarify, this is for this new wiring setup you guys came up with right? I have mine setup the way JustinC originally came up with and while it runs fine and Iv'e had no problems, I have very occasionally got that O2 heater CEL someone else mentioned.
