I'm waiting eagerly, but patiently.
This is some of the most interesting stuff that has taken place here on S2kI since I started hanging out here, and I'm quite sure the next installment will be well worth the wait.

 

ok, so i finally got some time on my hands to mess with my simulations again. since some are eager to see ap1 vs ap2, i decided to do it. on top of that, from reading tons of other threads about gears, i've found that some people recommend fitting the F20C with the ap2 tranny. personally i thought that was an interesting idea, so i added that to my simulation as well. hopefully, this post will kill 2 birds with one stone

starting of course with the dynos...

ap1 peaks at ~200 whp
ap2 peaks at ~210 whp

next, effective torque at the wheel


something i have not shown in these posts are plots of acceleration after drag has been taken into account. it looks like the effective torque graph, except drag is taken into account. basically i look at it to see if it's gear limited or drag limited, and from what i see, ap1 is obviously drag limited, and ap2 is barely gear limited. by that i mean when the gearing runs out, the amount of accelerative force is barely positive.

next, 0-60

very close, ap2 requires another shift, so it's up to the driver.

top speed

once again, both have almost the same top speed, although the ap2 gets there quite a bit quicker

finally, quarter mile

ap2 is quicker, but the F20C w/ ap2 tranny is right there pretty much the whole way. good case of more revs making up for less engine torque

IMO, bringing the F22C redline to 9k will increase performance quite a bit. the torque at the high end isn't falling by much at all. being able to stay in each gear for an additional 1k rpm will really help the effective torque.

 

this thread just keeps delivering

lets get some geared AP2 action up in here now

I want see some stock AP2 vs 4.77 AP2 numbers. The AP2 in stock form is right at redline in 4th gear when it hit the traps in the 1/4, so a little bump in power from I/H/E and tune is going to force you to shift into 5th I would imagine. At that point I imagine the 4.77s would be the best for a bolt-on AP2 in a drag situation.

I've also been thinking about stepping down to a 3.90 gear to eliminate the shift to 5th, Id be interested in seeing that as well. 3.90 would also rock in an AutoX, I know many times Im sitting at the top of 1st thinking "do I really want to shift to 2nd?" , and this is with a 9k redline (only taking it to around 8500). If my 1st gear were longer I wouldnt have this though and could hang out at peak power and a greater speed.

Maybe I just need to go with the AP1 tranny haha

 

i guess if you autoX, this could be a good mod along with lifting the F22C redline. simulating it in a quarter mile wouldn't really help you much, because you really just need information about the first 2 gears - top speed, effective torque. i think sacrificing a bit of effective torque for higher top speed in those gears would be beneficial, although it would really depend on the course.

 

Nice work.

A good round up of the gear options like you did for the AP1 on the AP2 would be nice to see.

Thanks for all the time you have spent thusfar.

 

Can we expect that an AP2 with the various gears versus the AP1 with various gears?

I'm assuming since the AP2 is slightly faster stock, with gears it would be the same result as the various gears results in the ap1 in the 0-60, quarter mile, etc?

 

Great work, I had assumed the Ap2 tranny gearing would be an advantage, and it certainly is for both cars.

 

I can't seem to zoom in on the pictures, but is 0-60 a tie AP1 vs AP2 even with the extra shift?

 

do pictures have to be in a public album for people to view in its original size?

yes, with the extra shift, 0-60 is pretty much a tie.

 

You are my hero.

Great work!!!!

Taking the driver out of the equation should help put some of the "great debates" to rest.

The range from quickest to slowest looks like about 0.3 seconds. That's close to 1/3 of a second, and well within the variances of reaction time and shifting speed variations, so (like I keep telling everyone) it's a drivers race.

[QUOTE=S2-3456789-K,Sep 14 2007, 05:08 PM]finally, quarter mile

ap2 is quicker, but the F20C w/ ap2 tranny is right there pretty much the whole way. good case of more revs making up for less engine torque