I can feel the love, can you?

 

Ah,ta hell with it all......WHO WANTS PIE.

 

"If you apply the same pressure over a smaller area (therefore increasing the pressure/area, or PSI in common measurements) you increase the coefficient of friction."

OK, how does the coefficient of friction change with pressure? The coefficient of friction is a ratio of how much force is required to turn the brakes to the force the calipers clamp with. It is a constant (in theory). Minor in physics or not, that is wrong.

According to your logic, if more pressure can raise the coefficient of friction, then you could increase the cornering ability of a car by increasing the weight since that would raise the coefficient of friction between the tires and the road.

The rest of my comments were not directed specifically at you, nothing personal.

 

Beautiful modifications, the rest of the thread is pure envy rearing its ugly head...

Tan

 

You're right RicePimp, I meant the quantity of friction generated.

 

PS Can't we all just get along?

 

Didn't mean to be condescending. I apologize for that.

Anyway I don't think there's any way someone could see this thread and not hear both sides of the issue so I guess there isn't any point in drawing this out so I'll just leave on a good tone.

 

Excellent idea. All sides have been presented over and over again and without any real hard data then it's all a moot point.

Andrew

 

I love when a fast typist can cut and past the remarks to fit their ideas .

Put this in one of you posts " davepk with Pinnacle Braking Kit fastest lap) they work !!!

Don't spent a lot of time on physics , the key boards won't take the strain .

We will be doing some high tech testing soon , so if any of you arm chair people want to bring your cars we will let you know how well your brakes work . We are going to test the brake systems with a data acquisition system , gathering data in real time ( uses D-GPS ), we will also do temperature testing at the same time . The live data system will give us 0 to 60 distance tests , G's obtained and it will let us log where ABS kicks in .The goal ( all of you arm chair racers missed ) of a great brake system is the ability to modulate the brakes . ( being able to make the brakes do what the foot directs them to ) The heat management part of the equation is just that , measure the heat produced and install the parts that can handle the heat ) The real item in this kit that sets it apart , from the other kits is the forged caliper . When you buy a AP Racing caliper that costs $2,000 to $3,000 each , what are you buying? " reduced flex in the caliper ". Yes we could install Wilwood calipers and save money , but this isn't what we wanted in a performance kit . The reason that most of those cars have Wilwood kits , is just that cost , every one wants better brakes ,but does not know what better means . The Brembo kits that are installed on many peoples cars , where the rotor is 13" and weighs more the stock rotor . Does the bias in the car remain the same? What you get is the ability to hold more heat , but do the brakes modulate better ? Does the heavy mass of the rotor turn the front wheels into gyros .
We could use other aluminum , than 7075 for the adapter bracket , but we wanted no flex . We did not have to nickel plate all the parts , but we do. We did not have to use forged racing hats but we do . You are correct you get what you pay for !!!!
I love when people first install racing pads and tell you " I thought I was going to go through the windshield " is this a great improvement ? The foot can't control the brakes any more . Once the brakes reach a point that the tires can't handle and begin sliding ,good old ABS does what it does best, try to help you drive the car , as it pulse's its grab release , grab release it does not know how to use high coefficient pads either. Most racing pads can tolerate much higher temperatures than stock , and most people on the track will have to use them , to work in the heat range that the rotors are running . But you have not improved the ability to modulate the brakes . You have just increased their heat tolerance , some times making it very hard to drive the car fast , plus the ABS does not like , high coefficient pads because the system does not know that you have installed them and there is no way to change the computer that operates them , other that turn ABS off.
"Some Other Guy "
Bring on what ever you drive and I will deliver the data that will make your car stop better , even if you use some one else's parts . What I will deliver to you is the information that will let you know how well your brakes really work . No Charge!!!
How many Vendors have made that offer?

Cthree
Don't wish for Carbon or ceramic brakes , the temperatures to make them work and the increased heat added to the calipers ,wheels and other parts is not that great of a trade off . Plus remember that other word "COST". For cars that need them ( Super high braking requirements , lots of down force keeping tires planted ), they work , but they can also afford them.
Unless some one has a real question that , really effects braking . Spend your time reading about brakes and how to improve them . I will try to answer any questions or get the answer from one of the companies engineers that we work with .
I think that there are far to many dead horses in this world already.

brad

 

Ducting, quality racing pads, and high-temp fluid in an otherwise stock S2000 braking system will do the job, period. What does King Motorsports use in their race car? Stock rotors with Hawk Blues. It's not like they couldn't afford "better" brakes, it's that the car doesn't need it.

We ought not throw Dave's lap times around as a meter of brake performance, especially without his consent and/or input. Could be the brakes helped, could be they slowed him down (pun intended ). Too many other variables.

Which isn't to say this system is without its merits. If you guys could just all stick to saying that they look cool and are guaranteed to perform just fine on the street or for light brake-use racing like drag or autocross (as at least 90% of S2K owners will never road race their car) you'll sell just as many units and not draw all this flak from the racer crowd. I think that was Rick's original message but it was soon lost as this thead became a mess 15 posts later...

**jzr kisses the ground and thanks god he's not a salesman**

It's unfortunate for you guys trying to make a living at this that most consumers falsely believe they'll need any of the braking ability beyond what your kit offers. Folks, nothing you do in your "spirited street driving" or even on a "hard canyon run" will approach the limits of this aftermarket kit or even the stock setup with good pads and fluid. If you're hesitating to purchase for that reason, stop, get your credit card out, and make the order. If you don't forsee yourself pushing your car to limits you never imagined possible for extended periods on a brake-heavy racetrack in your race-tire equipped S2000, you won't regret it.
Peace love, and happiness everyone!