S2000 vs Miata: driving at "the limit"
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,683
Likes: 25
From: SoFlo
Cause of 'scary at the limit' = driver error.
They are some of the most neutral and best handling cars on the market.
Stupid inputs from driver = stupid response from the car.
I like the new MX5 as well, its a great car but needs suspension. With aftermarket suspension it will be a riot at a track (even at stock power levels). Threow a turbo on there and it'll be more than enough fun.
They are some of the most neutral and best handling cars on the market.
Stupid inputs from driver = stupid response from the car.
I like the new MX5 as well, its a great car but needs suspension. With aftermarket suspension it will be a riot at a track (even at stock power levels). Threow a turbo on there and it'll be more than enough fun.
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 2
From: Dry Branch
Originally Posted by relapse,Feb 14 2008, 07:07 PM
wow all this talk of the s2000 being unstable at its limits is starting to scare me. my fd is very stable during high speeds. i was looking for a trade on my fd but may have to think this through...
The S2000 will do exactly what you tell it to do. It can even be "tossed" and "caught," and will do what you ask with lazer like accuracy. However, you have to know how the car works to get it to do what you want. The car does not have a mind of its own, and it won't get you into trouble unless you insist. Learn how the car works, and avoid driving it in a way that exceeds your own skills, and it is unlikely that you'll have problems. Sure, the car will bite you if you drive it like an idiot, but if you treat it with respect, it's a very easy car to drive. Any car (even a Yugo) can bite, if the driver is doesn't respect it's capabilities and limits.
Just keep in mind that lots of S2000 owners have had spin related accidents. Learn about the things that have contributed to their accidents, and avoid them.
Drive within your own limits, and you'll be VERY unlikely to ever have a problem.
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 2
From: Dry Branch
Originally Posted by Vik2000,Feb 14 2008, 07:05 PM
Chuck never ceases to amaze me with his extensive knowledge and experience 
We all start out as noobs.
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,683
Likes: 25
From: SoFlo
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Feb 14 2008, 04:49 PM
While I'm in agreement with what you said above, this ^^^ particular point needs some clarification. IF the car is in good repair, the statement is true. However, and just as one of many possible examples, my car was extremely scary a while back, and at the limit, at speed, it was terrifying. At a little over 100 MPH the car would start feeling very unstable, and by 130 it was scary. Entering a turn at 130 it felt like the car was all over the road, and in fact, it was all over the road, and it was terrifying. I guess you could say that continuing to drive the car in that condition would have been a driver error, and I didn't make that mistake (the problem was that my alignment guy had gotten the rear toe wrong, and I was running very close to zero rear toe). I guess you could say that not checking the alignment myself was a driver error, but watching all the work that is done to a car is not always an option. The car was scary becasue of someone else's error, not the driver's error.In general though, when the car is scary, somebody either is making, or has made, one or more mistakes. The fear is a warning that there is risk that needs to be considered.
Throwing variables such as an improper alignment, wrong tire choice, sizing, compound, blow shock, spare tire, messed up cross weight, etc... are all factors that will make any car work incorrectly. Mentioning your messed up alignment is irrelevant as when you start changing things, its those changes which cause the result of the handling.
A stock S2000 is very neutral and like all production cars still is set up with a hint of understeer to keep the car safe. But the chassis dynamics of the car is very good that you can easily make the car over-understeer depending on your inputs (similarly to an NSX, RX8, Elise, or Viper).
A responsive car that responds to what you tell it to is not dangerous. If YOU are giving it the wrong inputs then YOU are dangerous and the cause of your own problems.
Go to a track day, learn to push your car in a safe environment and try to get a 'good' instructor go point you in the right direction.
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
I'm a newb at this forum. I just recently purchased an AP1, with the sole intent of becoming a better driver as a result. I've owned other rwd cars before, the most recent being a 944S (which I still have). But driving a fwd as a dd (MkV GTI) was starting to create bad habits in my driving, making me rather careless and detached IMO to the car's behavior. With the AP1, I'm now slowly inching my way to learing to drive properly. But as mentioned previously by many others, if you only intend to use it as a dd, you can easily do so without having to worry about it biting you. It's just a fantastic car in every way, whether on the road or the track.