[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Saini
[B]
Which brings up another key point... with our car being $15-20k cheaper than the Boxster, we have allot of younger owners with more testosterone than sense.

 

OK, no problem.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jimmy325
[B]

Cedric, how did you bring that old post back?

 

Idiosyncrasies, perhaps, but yes, no design flaws, imo.

At the Streets of Willow my instructor, a modified 1986 911 owner, mentioned how balanced the S2000 seemed. The results of an alignment I had done a few weeks previous came shining through. Whereas I hated the slow/moderate speed understeer and excessive front tire scrubbing, the car would take turns very well.

The back tires came out on two occasions at Streets when they were a little cold (A032Rs) but I was able to get them under control with steering correction; no violent snap oversteer.

I think a larger front sway bar might adversely affect the handling as I now have it at this time. I really am enjoying this car.

 

[C'mon guys. A very few people here like for the threads to become about the posters rather than the topic. In this thread, it's become really obvious. It is up to the rest of us -- the clear majority -- to keep the posts on-topic and off posters.

Yes, I know it sounds wacky but some of our members would rather see us arguing about our members (either themselves or someone else) than about our cars. Insulting comment is one of the more common baiting tactics. Playing the victim is perhaps another.

In the end, it is our collective choice whether to play or not. We determine the civility and custsom here. As elsewhere, though, good information might be chased away by bad behavior.]

So regarding the accidents, they are facinating from a statistical perspective, I think.

1. They virtually all seem to be the same kind of accident, an oversteer spin.
2. Rear-enders are the most common kind of accident among inexperienced drivers't aren't they?
3. The cars seem to virtually all stock. The driver is the key variable but doesn't seem to affect the kind of accident.
5. Quite a few drivers with RWD experience (and no accident) seem to notice the condition.
4. Racing seems to make the condition more noticable as does more spirited driving.

I'm guessing we're not there yet. I'd love to be able to have an accident database for isolating variables.

 

Good points, Jim... and I was sorry to have offended both Strike, Cedric, and any others. My point simply was that if a car exhibits deficiencies when pushed to the limit at the track, then those deficiencies can cause less experienced drivers to lose control when 'testing' the limits of the car.

And Prolene... Streets of Willow may be a very smooth track, or possibly your instructor was a very good driver. Also, as an instructor from time to time myself, I know that you don't push a student's car to 100%. Again, the problem comes to a head at 100%. If your instructor was driving at 8/10ths, then that would explain his experience.

Just for the record, I don't think anyone is wrong here... those of you that keep your car at a low enough limit to enjoy it without consequences aren't doing anything wrong. It's OK to enjoy your car in that way, and I've said it before... the S2000 makes a better street car than a race car. That being said, I love the car enough to try an represent it well at National level autocross competition. I'm not going to quit now! A Boxster won this year, but if I have anything to say about it, an S2000 WILL win next year!

 

What statistics? Show us some numbers.

As far as the most common accident for inexperienced drivers you are missing the point.
I don't think anyone here has bought the S2000 as their first car. When we speak of inexperience in THIS context we are talking about people with limited experience with a high performance, short wheelbase, rear wheel drive, mid engined car tuned to oversteer.

Like anything else in life the problem becomes clearer with hindsight. Those who have reached a certain level of competence in their performance driving skills can see quite clearly how these accidents have happened. Those who think they have nothing else to learn about driving and think they have more skills than they really do keep insisting there must be something more than their lack of skill causing these accidents. Hopefully at some future point they will learn a technique or two that will all of a sudden become a EUREKA! moment and all the pieces will fall into place. I only hope they have not buggered their cars up so much beforehand trying to fix what was not broken so they can actually appreciate it. As for me,...I have driven this car for two years now and everyday I drive it I learn something new. The excellence of this car only reveals itself with correct technique on the part of the driver. The dark side of this car reveals itself to all other techniques.

Like I have said before there are two things a young man will think he knows everything about, making love and driving.

Most woman know better.

 

Jason, It was smooth, at least to me. Actually, the instructor made his opinion having never driven my car; I had all the track time, so I guess his comment can be taken with grain(s) of salt.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Saini
[B]That being said, I love the car enough to try and represent it well at National level autocross competition.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Saini
[B]Good points, Jim... and I was sorry to have offended both Strike, Cedric, and any others.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Saini
[B]

Just for the record, I don't think anyone is wrong here... those of you that keep your car at a low enough limit to enjoy it without consequences aren't doing anything wrong.