Yep, an S2000 won in '00, and it was Gary Thomason at the wheel. He has won many National Championships in the past, and set his car up well from the beginning. Others have taken a little longer to set up the Boxster, but they are getting very fast (running on 18x8" front and 18x9" rear wheels). Gary sold his and moved to a Vette for '01.

I was third this season, behind a Boxster and another S2000. The other S2000 happened to be Gary Thomason's old one! Hopefully I can move up 2 places next season!

 

Jason,

With regards to Streets of Willow, there were 20+ S2000's there. While many of the S2K drivers were new to track driving there were also many with a lot of track experience. Not one person mentioned anything like bump steer, snap oversteer, or any other term that's been used to describe this behavior. I also don't remember it being mentioned at the Thunderhill event where we had another 25 S2000's on the track. It's experiences like those two days, along with my own personal experience, that helps form my opinion that this behavior only causes problems under certain specific sets of circumstances.

BTW, you haven't offended me in the least. I respect your opinions even if I sometimes don't agree. I also think we're closer to agreeing on this issue than it would seem but the medium we're using to discuss this tends to make things seem more black and white than they sometimes are.

 

Jason:

Are these Boxster S's?

 

Strike, I hear what you are saying... and it has taken a very long time for me, as an experienced racer, to identify some of these suspension issues. Who buys a new car and immediately tests bump-steer? It's been a long time coming to draw some of these conclusions. I don't expect the average driver to be able to identify bump-steer although I think that many people feel it and don't understand it. So even at a track day like the ones you described, and even if someone spun - they might not necessarily be able to attribute it to bump-steer.

And Cedric... they are Boxster 2.7 non-S's with the M030 suspension package (factory option) and the 18" wheel package. I drove one on a test day earlier this season, and while it doesn't have the ultimate power of the S2000, it sure has more grip with those wide wheels! wow! It's a cool car, with a slightly different character than the S2000, but a very prohibitive price tag! Even if they were the same price, I would still race the S2000... I think it has a much higher cool factor. And I never want to be a Porsche snob!

 

Jason I looked at aTT and a Boxster and test drove both before I bought the S2000. The Boxster was a 2.4 I'm pretty sure. I liked it but the S2000 had loads more zing!

So are the Boxster S's in a higher class?

 

Should we develop a new category called "I just want to argue with somebody"?

 

Yup... the S's are in a higher class. The 2.7's have 217hp, 23 shy of our car which is a significant difference. The first couple years of the base Boxster it was 2.5, which is probably what you drove. They were pretty anemic compared to the S2000! Although they may have had a 2.4 in the UK... you guys get all the low-displacement hardware... Price of petrol and all!

 

They changed the name to 'Street Encounters'.

 

Couple quick points...

Great thread - the most useful/interesting thread I've seen in S2000 talk in several months.

Whoever posted "Honda hasn't made a rear wheel drive car in many many years. Therefore the Honda enthusiasts have gotten used to the behavior of front wheel drive vehicles" is apparently ignoring the Honda NSX, which is an Acura to us yanks... You're right about being used to FWD, there's not too many RWD vehicles out there that don't share many of the same nasty/fun traits as the S2000...

Jason & Nick: Having spent some time at G-man, and knowing my approximate lap times, along with those of several other S2000s, what kind of lap times have you been turning? Admittedly neither of you runs a "stock" car, but I'm just curious to know how far off the pace I am...

 

Some forums have these... and they can be a load of fun... But because of the nature of this site and the fact that many of the owners/enthusiasts may eventually meet, I think it'd be best to avoid the hard feelings that extended intentional arguing can create.