Kyras

He finished his post with
"I could go on and on. Do these kind of issues bother anyone else out there, or am I just an old fogey living under a rock? "
and he entitled it Ethics am I alone?

It was an easy shot so I took it.

fltsfshr

 

Yes. I also agree with most of the points Bill makes.

When I disagree - as in the case of removal of pollution control devices - I try to make it clear I disagree because I think that the rules are good rules (e.g., catalytic convertors having saved about 2 million lives), not just because it's the law. Unfortunately, those at Stage 2 often can't tell the difference between a Stage 4 argument and a Stage 6 argument.

And Bill, I agree that a performance based standard rather than requirements for particular devices would be better. However, I'm also quite concerned about losing the environmental gains that we have made. Most of the people on this forum can remember the days when Lake Erie was so polluted it would occasionally catch on fire, but a lot of younger people don't realize that pollution can be a real problem.

 

I understand the concern. My comments were really about the obd II system. If you mod your car to the point that you change your electronic controls, the obd throws setting errors, or just doens't respond, and your car fails. Your car may be operating at or below the levels required, but without a fully fuctioning obd system, you fail. I don't know, I think that is just a bit too controlling.

 

I will admit that I did not read every word of every post before jumping in with my .02 here.

I realize that Hollywood claims that they produce movies that imitate real life not vice verser. Well, I for one am NOT SURE that is true.

I wish that I could remember what university it was (May have been Columbia, as that school is famous for studies in human behaviour) but after the Milken (junk bond king) epidsode where he got to keep $536 million after doing five years in jail. Gee, although that sounds unethical, that is not such a bad pay off. Then that was followed by Michael Douglas' famous "Greed is good" speach in "Wall Street". After these appeared in the public, a study of MBA's was done and they responded that they would be willing to go to jail for a big "pay off". Hmmm? Sound familiar these days with Enron and Worldcom?

 

Legal Bill, you nailed it! I want you as my lawyer. Excellent counterpoints.

 

Maybe a tangent, but unlike Enron and Worldcom, people who bought Milken's junk bonds did, on average, quite well - better, in fact, than those who bought many of the blue chip bonds of the day. I wouldn't put him in the same category as Ebbers.

 

OK fltsfshr, I'll accept your judgement and I agree with your point of view within reason. I guess I am an old fogey. My bottom line is that I think that many of us doom ourselves early by the choices we make. I suppose we can't choose for others, nor would I have wanted others choosing for me. The concern I expressed comes from a sense that none of the authors of the posts I mentioned seem to have any inkling that there is anything wrong with their approach...legally, morally, financially, or otherwise. Perhaps I'm completely wrong, and there really IS nothing wrong with their views. I hope that's not the case, as I could have had a lot more fun over the years. I was just wondering if I am alone in my concerns. Apparently, we vintage folks are somewhat split on the issue.

I'm not sour in my old age (heck, I'm not that old!), but I agree that geriatric judgementalism is not an attractive quality. I'll cease and desist.