[QUOTE]Originally posted by JonBoy
[B]
You know why I think that the "under God" phrase is being challenged?

 

TrojanHorse - good comment, but we're not fighting it. We aren't the ones walking through schools looking for anything referencing atheism to be taken out, are we? If atheism is viable, so is Christianity - each is a belief (notice that I'm not knocking atheism - what you believe is your choice). For me (and I think many others), there is a lot more to worry about for kids than a tiny phrase in the constitution. I mean, seriously - is it THAT big of a deal? I'm not American so this obviously doesn't affect me, but I still find it ludicrous. Obviously, as a Christian, I'd prefer to keep God in as much as possible (just as atheists would prefer to keep all of Him out of things), but that doesn't mean I go around searching for atheist statements and issues and try to get rid of them.

Either way, whatever happens....happens. In short, I think that we ALL have bigger problems than a two word phrase that "offends" us. If that's all that offends these people, they're being awfully lenient with the rest of the world... I'd hate to know what they "stand" for in this world...or perhaps they don't stand for anything - ie, everything is good.

Thanks for your comments, though - at least you answered politely. That's more than I can say for a lot of people.

Obviously, all of what I'm saying is merely my opinion, and I hope you'll treat it as such. I'm not saying I'm completely right or my point of view is the only valid one - just discussing (since that's what the forums are for).

 

It took a damn long time for evolution to be taught in public schools, and in some parts of the South the bible thumping masses are still fighting it.

Anyways, I agree that "two little words" it is not really that big a deal if you are in the Christian majority. But to atheists it is a big deal, look at all the posts on just this thread from atheists and agnostics for examples. If it was not such a big deal why the huge uproar back in 1954 to add them in the first place? Read the link I posted above about the history of the Pledge. You can see that the guy that wrote it was careful not to include any religion in it and was upset as it was modified over the years.

Enough blathering on my part, I agree it is a minor thing but obviously it is not, as seen by all the ruckus this court decision as caused. I salute the guy that brought on the case for having the fortitude to push it through, some "Christian" is probably going to put a bullet in his head for it or burn his house down but he stood up for his beliefs. People who fight for Christianity are missionaries or crusaders (depending on your timeframe), while people who fight for the absence of religion are troublemakers/satan worshippers/heretics/add your insult here.

This is all going to irrevalent in a few months as they will just keep appealing this case until they find a favorable court and get the ruling overturned anyways.

 

But on the other hand, how many instances are there of a public school requiring the children to chant something like "God does not exist."?

Not being a Christian, maybe I don't notice these things, but I'm curious how often is atheism (the belief that there is no God or gods, which doesn't have anything to do with the evolution debate, etc.) referenced in public schools?

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Garyj
[B]Appreciate your comments but you are wrong here.

 

Sorry about the triple postings, but my computer kept locking up when I tried to submit my reply.

 

And I thought it didn't get sent. My bad.

 

Elistan - how many times have you heard people in a school chant "God exists"? I've never heard it, at least not in that way. You could argue that "under God" is the same as saying that GOd exists, but they don't have to say it if they don't want to, do they? Why can't they just do that?

Let me put it this way - just because I (or anyone) say something by rote or memory doesn't necessarily mean that a) we believe it or b) we're even thinking about it.

For instance, I learned evolution in school (I've never heard of any school that didn't teach evolution - they just occasionally add creation in with it to give both points of view) and could repeat the theory easily. However, I don't believe it and don't subscribe to that theory - I didn't go around trying to say "I won't learn this because it offends my beliefs", nor did anyone else I know. The point is, as a Christian I'm not scared to learn about things I disagree with because my belief is strong enough that I know nothing will change my mind. However, if given an option, I would opt out of a lot of things...

As a second view, how many schools do you know that teach creation as the sole theory of existence? I don't know of any, even if they are a private Christian school with their own curriculum (which some of my friends and siblings attended). I think Christians have been pretty tolerant of nontheistic ideas in schools - the main problems come over major issues such as alternative relationships (gay/lesbian) being taught as "right", pre-marital sex, drugs, and a plethora of other issues we feel are far more dangerous for the young people today. Not only are they dangerous, but they are in direct contradiction of the Bible which is what we run our lives by. However, when we have problems with things, we don't say "Take it out of the school completely" - nope, instead we just say "Can we have our children excused from this?" and move on... It's much easier, less controversial, and doesn't infringe on anyone.

Bottom line: People don't have to recite "under God" if they don't want to. Just don't take it away from people that do...

 

If aetheists don't believe in God, then what do they care if He exists or not? How can this one person dictate what the majority of Americans believe in?
Also, it may only be two words now, but how many words will be censored next time.... and the time after that? What words will they be? When will it end?

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DarioManfretti
[B]If aetheists don't believe in God, then what do they care if He exists or not? How can this one person dictate what the majority of Americans believe in?
Also, it may only be two words now, but how many words will be censored next time....