This is mostly what I found and was told by ILP when I first researched build options - that a sleeved block introduced other headaches and wasn’t beneficial for my power goals (400-450whp supercharged)

 

Ya makes sense. I'd avoid aftermarket sleeves as well if at all possible. I know next to nothing about these FRM linings. I thought there were a few people on this forum with Inlinepro "refreshed" builds. I'd be interested to hear if they're running the same setup or something different.

 

whats ridiculous about it? there's a reason no one runs that shit on H/F/K series with FRM cylinders... OP has had 2 engines (including the current one) with cylinder issues in case you missed it... lol thats not the knock but absent the knock, he has other problems... the point is that the machinist who prescribed the past 3 motors is either unfamiliar with honda engines or a scumbag running up a bill..

 

Couldn't have said itsany better.

 

i come from a hrc background honda race craft "motorcycles" they have ben usinge frm sense 90. the thing to remember is the piston now becomes the liner its got the hard surfcace. this was pioneered in the late 60s in canam racing using big block chevy engines running aluminum blocks without liners trw was using some iron graphite coating to do the same thing the motors did last because the aluminum wouldnt hold its shape. fast forward and honda drops a kevlar bobin into there cylinder castings and wala the aluminum doesnt distort quickly you are still bound to a spiecfic coating on the piston to keep the chance of gwaling at bay. ive rebuild so many cbr motors where we had a special hone we would run up and down with a pressure gauge on it. with a and b pistons you could clean up some light wear and drop in replacements and it would be good to go. on the race stuff we ran them so loose they had no oil pressure at idle with an electric vacuum pump to keep the pistons sealed as high rpm. there is very little room to over bore as you will hit fiber then its over. also the stones have to be cleaned a crazy amount if you want it right. ive only seen a few people shops that really understood them and as the throw away culture has grown most of them have faded away or died as one of the builders mentioned earlier has though i heard his son took over. on the new old blocks what i recommend and am saying this from my experience with the bike engines it to prelube them. setting for years leaves them dry and bearing damage will result so pull cam tower on an f motor and pump oil down from the head feed would be the easiest id think there is a screw that meters pressure i would pull it use air to pump a few quarts down through it till it show on the stick lube the cams and install. on the tune front knock will register everything in there the software is tuned to a certain frequency i modifiedd the range on my aem v2 so i get more data in this area. to all you i say give them a tune and they my thrash for a season teach them and they my thrash in any season or altitude. there is a set of videos on youtube by Jonathan fasking that goes through the whole tuning setup. learn it and save yourselves i have been anywhere from 21to 17 psi for 40k miles on my tune with a junkyard f22c with low idle pressure and its reliable have made right at 500whp currently at 16-18psi as 465whp 300tq with a vmount some meth and a lot of timing its spicy and happy. stay stock pull it and put new pistons and bearings in at 150k miles then repeat it works for my f22c just as it did in the cbr900rr way back. they have a service life. if you increase pressure you increase wear. i also increase my base oil as i increase power id rather throw away a few hp for longer life as that is the trade off. im telling you stuff most i the know wont because it never good to tip your hand. also having run loose motors on thin oil and stock on thin loose on thick etc i was able to see the difference. your not pulling it apart every 4 races dont use those tactics. also while im telling it if you run your oil over 250f more than s few times you hurt your mains..... 280f on the diff and trans.... just an old honda race tech here sloth2k out

 

well after they stepped up and fixed it twice i figured go with ip. they stand behind their product. 3 times, avoid this place like the plague

 

There are two parts of working with a supplier. One is them standing behind their product. So far they have, which is good. However, the other part is them having the correct people/resources/knowledge to do the work in the first place. This may be coming into question here. It matters not at all if they were "great in the past" but only the current quality of their work. While they have replaced the motor already which is good, having to deal with the same issues repeatedly is not. It is kind of like people who will buy cars with tons of known issues and say "well they cover it under warranty". That is great and all but means nothing if you keep missing work, track time, etc because your car is always broken. And ... that is not a good sign of how said car will perform AFTER warranty. My worry here would be even if the next motor they build seems great, what happens in a year when they can say "this is a race engine and there is no warranty" and the motor is trash again? If it were me, I would respectfully ask them for my money back vs another build. and look elsewhere at this point.

 

This is some good info but really hard to read. I'm not trying to be a grammar nazi but that wall of text is pretty daunting. When you recommend refreshing an OEM block at 150k, I assume you mean with OEM pistons? Any honing recommended or do not touch the walls?

 

dude's a wrench, not a poet haha... i read it fine but i hang out with people who talk the way he types. he's saying you could run standard or oversized piston depending on the condition of your cylinders. he is also saying that for high heat application (race) he runs them extremely loose without issue aside from oil consumption. with the methodology above (changing bearings, rings and if necessary, pistons) he's getting a lot of miles out of his 465whp setup more or less beating the piss out of it.

 

i the walls are good dont touch them. make sure tune it god drop in new add 10 thou to ring gap or more. heat cycle low for leaks and send it. another thing we learnedd with new low tension ring packs if the tune is good go dive it like you stole it. when we did this we form om carbon below top ring versus easy doing and carbon to the oil rings .

sorry for not breaking up my paragraphs. hard to recall all the info while being kind to your mind.....