This is still going on?

 

It's been going on since 03.

 

Not to 60 it isn't...

My argument has been that the underlying difference is within the testing repeatability error. 0.1 to 60, 0.1 in the 1/4, and 1mph in the 1/4 are within this margin. There will be other tests of either car that are both faster and slower.

The cars are essentially equal in the 1/4.

More torque = advantage. Less rpm headroom = disadvantage. Never said or implied that the rpm-headroom disadvantage more than offset the torque advantage, it doesn't.

Viper revs to 6500. Anyway, not pertinent to current discussion.

Any car would benefit from having enough rpm headroom above peak power such that after upshifting it doesn't fall to a lower power level in the next gear up.

You can *literally* find AP1s that *are* faster than AP2s. Not all examples of each are IDENTICAL. You can't look at one test of each car and conclude: AP2 is faster than AP1, because it won't always be true.

Any start/stop speed or distance you choose is arbitrary. You can choose from/to speeds where the AP1 will be quicker, and you can choose from/to speeds where the AP2 is quicker.


Long/short: they are essentially the same in terms of acceleration performance.

 

You'd have to hunt for an AP1 faster than an AP2. The other way around will almost always be true. No need to draw silly diagrams of intersecting Gaussian curves and measuring the areas...

How about "Average AP2 is faster than an average AP1"?

 

The next Car and Driver test of an AP2 I found:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-specs-page-2

0-60: 5.4 (vs. 5.4 for our AP1 above). But 0-60 doesn't count anyway, right?
1/4-mile: 14.1 @ 97 (vs. 14.1 @ 99 for our AP1 above)

Hey, AP1 is FASTER! By the logic presented by others, I should rest my case on this. But the fact is, differences between tests of the same year cars is greater than differences overall between AP1 and AP2. They're *that* close.

Well, probably more AP1's, on average, are dead by now, so I'll give you that

 

You just won't accept it, will you? Well, I understand...

My last try: "Average living AP2 is faster than average living AP1"

 

Accept WHAT? That the AP2 *feels* faster? It does, no question. I don't have NEARLY enough info to agree with (or dispute) the statement: "Average living AP2 is faster than average living AP1"

If the *average* ap2 is a 13.9 @ 101mph car and the *average* AP1 is a 14.1 @ 99 mph car, or vice versa, IMO they're still equivalent as far as I'm concerned.

Anyone looking for ABSOLUTE numbers to CATEGORICALLY say that one is quicker/faster than the other is on a fool's errand.

 

When i was shopping for an s2000, I ended with an ap1 over an ap2 due to my research. I personally like to rev my engine out to 9k, having a quicker steering ratio, and having the car more of a handful to drive at the limit. I'm sure the slight torque increase makes the ap2 great to drive as a daily, but at the end of the day, it's just a torque less high revving 4 cylinder. The quarter mile times are both too similar to compare IMHO. The only significant thing you can compare between the two cars are driving feel because hard numbers are too insignificant to compare.

 

I can live with "Ap2 feels faster than Ap1". No need to play with numbers, areas under curves, or statistical arguments such as the probability of finding an AP1 that is actually faster than an Ap2...

 

The AP1 was what made me want to get an S2000 in the first place, but I ended up buying an AP2. The extra 1000 rpm doesn't really matter to me if the car is still slow so I chose the one that was newer.