Nice write up James, Mike, and Chris. Thanks for taking the time and making sure there is as little error in the comparisons as possible (same scales, day, etc.) It looks like in a completely equal prep, the AP1, AP2, and CR will be less than 100lbs given the extra items that can be done to each. I see the AP2 has the stock cat, more fuel, and the hitch assembly. The 80lb difference make zero sense to me with the AP1 vs AP2. There has to be something unaccounted for. Still, I argue 100lbs is within driver noise on these much more powerful STR cars that are 30% heavier than STS. Given the time differences at the tours this year in STR, the driver mod is still, by far, the most important mod.

I propose a letter to allow all cars to be equally prepped ... allow a/c & radio and soft top removal (with the addition of the CR stuff). Those worried about costs can leave all the luxury equipment in if they prefer to go an easier route, save the cash, and not bothered by the extra weight. Saving every pound possible will be expensive, but for the few people that are so worried about it, they will have the opportunity to spend their way to be the lightest. There you have it, done, as equal and fair as I can imagine. Will it happen? My guess is no. Other classes are in much worse shape and will likely get attention first. I will still support it.

-Marc

 

I too believe that 100-150 lbs is within driver noise. My st civic is at about 2080 lbs and would be considered the "wrong" civic for the class compared to the Japanese 89 version which is about 100 lighter. Hollis' civic is somewhere like 1965lbs in st prep. Jeff Wong and my 91 si are close in weight. I don't see myself being handicap and I don't see that situation as well with my Str 06 s2000. Of course it would be nice to have the cr but I don't see it as a must have. Tune your cars to the best of your ability and drive the crap out of it and results will happen.

 

Ok, coming from this thread...

So it sounds like a 255/40/17 +45 MIGHT work, but not without headaches. The most aggressive roll incuding the tabs bent up, and the most neg camber. So if it still hits you guys are saying it would do damage? Am I correct in saying that it's the front that is the bigger issue and the rear may be ok? Tire rack is basically one day shipping for me, I will likely have to eat the cost of returning, but it could be much worse I guess.

 

Remember, you have to turn the wheel while the suspension is compressed. Just because you can tuck the tire does not mean it will work when racing.

 

This generally occurs when you have a 280'+ spin out with the steering wheel still aggressively turned out (trying to counter steer). The rear goes first followed by the front. Ex ... If you spin the rear on the left (drivers side), the damage comes from the passenger front when it loops back around. This happened with my late '05 S2000 on 17x7+50mm Kosei K1-TS and 245/45/17 V710s.

I would suggest going with a higher offset on the front (55-65 range). The front has plenty of grip so losing some of the stagger out won't hurt, the rear will be your challenge.

-Marc

 

60 ft times at a pro solo can't be compared to drag strip times, for many of the reasons mentioned already. Rocky mountain pro is probably the worst to use, due to the elevation, uphill inclination (largest I've ever seen), and so so traction from the asphalt. The other big factor no one mentioned is tire. Hankooks are just average in regards to acceleration grip. The Toyos are much better, and one of the reasons why many MX5 s are faster to the 60 ft. lastly, the 60 ft marker is measured with a measure wheel so 60 ft measurement can be off.

 

Spend the 18k on racing and seat time for the next couple of years. You will be much faster with this than by purchasing a CR and (at most) loosing 100 pounds!

-Marc

 

Thanks to the nice Nationals staff (esp Grady) for letting us do this. Also thanks to the guys who let us use their cars for weighin.

We'll it is a MY2000, and they're supposed to be lightest of ap1s. Ap1 flywheel is lighter, interior a lil lighter, etc.

Yeah, but when the dust settles, it won't be just about the driver, it will also be about the car. At Nationals level competition, every pound counts. If it didn't, everyone would run stock wheels and exhausts in stock class, which they clearly do not (including you marc) . Drivers of equal skill will show up, and then its all about the car, not driver. Ever seen the weigh ins of cars? I work impound a lot, and its amazing how close everyone is to min weight.

Like I said before, they used to have a rule that allowed ppl to remove AC, which they took back a couple years ago. They're not gonna take back on a take back. You allow AC and radio removal, and it affects ALL ST cars. Radios aren't even a big deal in the s2000, but other cars like M3s with very nice sound systems can lose a lot of weight. Ditto for top removal. Might not affect STR much, but you think the Crx guys will be happy when STS miatas cam remove the top? Gotta make a solution that will impact the least amount of people. Making the CR run with its top is a pretty elegant solution if you ask me. But again, I'm not gonna toss the first stone on this one. I got my hands full with ecu upgrade rules.

 

Dude, you're the VERY DEFINITION of "handicap" : p

 

Just a joke