the Official "NA Tuning" thread
after i hit 230, i will be headed for 240!
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From: DFW, TX
Originally Posted by 2QYK4U,Jun 8 2006, 04:38 AM
You won't get there without upgraded cams, ITBs, etc.
Though, now that my friend has a Z, its making me want boost. He can stay even with me, and he is completely stock ( an 04'). However this is only with traction control off, with traction control on I pull away from him like I should...so aparently traction control has been robing some hp all this time in Z's and they really have been faster. We are going to get a video comparison...between me and him and probably a stock s2k and him.
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^ Good luck on your quest. Don't be too dissappointed if you don't make the power you hope to make.
BTW...I now have a single exhaust and my S will be getting retuned. IMO, if my S doesn't make 240rwhp you guys don't stand much of a chance getting there either. I don't know your exact mods, but I don't think you've gone to the extreme I have (i.e., removed A/C compressor which reduces some parasitic loss).
BTW...I now have a single exhaust and my S will be getting retuned. IMO, if my S doesn't make 240rwhp you guys don't stand much of a chance getting there either. I don't know your exact mods, but I don't think you've gone to the extreme I have (i.e., removed A/C compressor which reduces some parasitic loss).
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From: Seattle, WA
2qyk4u - I think the one part you've missed on was the J's header. The Toda doesn't show the high end gains that the J's does. It's goign to be interesting to see how everyone fares in the next several months though.
Oh, my friend is going to a master tech automotive school in August, and he says he may use his intake manifold and head as a guinea pig - so I may get some headwork/porting and whatnot for cheap/free. We'll see.
Oh, my friend is going to a master tech automotive school in August, and he says he may use his intake manifold and head as a guinea pig - so I may get some headwork/porting and whatnot for cheap/free. We'll see.
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Originally Posted by Silver9k,Jun 8 2006, 03:09 PM
I know your running the Hondata...I'm running an AEM EMS.
As far as removing the A/C compressor...the MOST you will gain is maybe 1hp by removing it...it does not pull hardley ANY power from the engine unless the A/C is turned on, in which case you shouldn't be running it up to 9k anyway. Or 8k in your case. Same with things like the alternator...the alternator itself only takes about 1.5-2hp from the motor when running 2 being that it is currently hot, ineffiecent and maxium amps are being requested of it...you could figure this out by simply: Power (watts) = volts * amps Watts/746 = 1hp, so 14v * 75amps (typical) = 1050w 1050/746 = 1.4hp and that is at perfect efficency. Now if the alternator was not needing to put out amps, hp stolen is slightly less.
I guess I'm just trying to make the point that spinning a pulley takes virtually no hp from the engine. and that your power mods are not THAT extensive:
Toda exhaust manifold, custom single 3" exhaust, AEM CAI, Hondata IMG, Hondata ECU reflash
You don't have the best exhaust manifold for power, and 3" exhaust is debatable as to whether or not its better the 2.75" (70mm) on an N/A car but we can call that a negligable difference. I'm guessing you DO have a test pipe if you are talking about these numbers, if not...there is definite power there. The pulleys don't add power spinning that extra 2 lbs or whatever they reduce takes nothing...but they do look nice. You don't have a 70mm throttle body port matched to your intake manifold...you don't have an aftermarket intake manifold (not that there is one, but if done right there is power to be had there) You don't have cams...and some mild Toda spec A's will probably bump a little chunk of power in there too. Also you can bump your compression up a little especially since you can tune and again that will add a little more power, and ESPECIALLY in your case look into simply stronger rods and rev the motor out more. THEN I would say you are getting Extreme...for now, your just as far into as the rest of us and I wouldn't imagine you would make much more the 230.
But thanks for the good luck.
I've started to think about getting a small turbo, very fast spooling (before 4k) flows enough air at 7psi to make 300whp and placeable to be able to be a quick bolt on. If that set-up is possible...I will look that way, as well it would basically be like n/a even on the track if it spooled very quickly, then at 7k rpm the turbo will take less then 1 sec to get 7psi and well...thats pretty damn instant and be linear after that.
As far as removing the A/C compressor...the MOST you will gain is maybe 1hp by removing it...it does not pull hardley ANY power from the engine unless the A/C is turned on, in which case you shouldn't be running it up to 9k anyway. Or 8k in your case. Same with things like the alternator...the alternator itself only takes about 1.5-2hp from the motor when running 2 being that it is currently hot, ineffiecent and maxium amps are being requested of it...you could figure this out by simply: Power (watts) = volts * amps Watts/746 = 1hp, so 14v * 75amps (typical) = 1050w 1050/746 = 1.4hp and that is at perfect efficency. Now if the alternator was not needing to put out amps, hp stolen is slightly less.
I guess I'm just trying to make the point that spinning a pulley takes virtually no hp from the engine. and that your power mods are not THAT extensive:
Toda exhaust manifold, custom single 3" exhaust, AEM CAI, Hondata IMG, Hondata ECU reflash
You don't have the best exhaust manifold for power, and 3" exhaust is debatable as to whether or not its better the 2.75" (70mm) on an N/A car but we can call that a negligable difference. I'm guessing you DO have a test pipe if you are talking about these numbers, if not...there is definite power there. The pulleys don't add power spinning that extra 2 lbs or whatever they reduce takes nothing...but they do look nice. You don't have a 70mm throttle body port matched to your intake manifold...you don't have an aftermarket intake manifold (not that there is one, but if done right there is power to be had there) You don't have cams...and some mild Toda spec A's will probably bump a little chunk of power in there too. Also you can bump your compression up a little especially since you can tune and again that will add a little more power, and ESPECIALLY in your case look into simply stronger rods and rev the motor out more. THEN I would say you are getting Extreme...for now, your just as far into as the rest of us and I wouldn't imagine you would make much more the 230.
But thanks for the good luck.
I've started to think about getting a small turbo, very fast spooling (before 4k) flows enough air at 7psi to make 300whp and placeable to be able to be a quick bolt on. If that set-up is possible...I will look that way, as well it would basically be like n/a even on the track if it spooled very quickly, then at 7k rpm the turbo will take less then 1 sec to get 7psi and well...thats pretty damn instant and be linear after that.
2. Your right--removing the a/c system does not free-up a whole lot of power. I would be willing to bet it frees up 1-2rwhp, especially when coupled with the lightweight pulleys and tensioners.
3. My rev limiter is 8500, not 8000.
4. I don't have the best header for power? Please show me dyno graphs comparing the Toda to other headers.
5. I don't have a TP...my exhaust is header back.
6. TB port-matched, upgrades cams, etc. is not considered bolt-ons. I believe the debate is over whether or not you can make 240rwhp with bolt-ons and tuning. If my understanding is correct, these upgrades you are talking about shouldn't even be mentioned.
Again, please prove me wrong and show me an S2000 making 240rwhp with bolt-ons and tuning. Your problem will be that you can't or won't be able to show me, because it just isn't going to happen.
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From: Santa Clara, California
Originally Posted by 2QYK4U,Jun 8 2006, 04:12 PM
Again, please prove me wrong and show me an S2000 making 240rwhp with bolt-ons and tuning. Your problem will be that you can't or won't be able to show me, because it just isn't going to happen.