the Official "NA Tuning" thread
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Originally Posted by ALaS,Oct 19 2006, 02:25 PM
How hard is it to accomplish this? I want to have the 4.77 street pull, but still have the highway driveability. How much extra is it to make your 5th and 6th gears taller?
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HvRRZ, you are correct on the fact that a PART of those gains are from the lower v-tec engagement however, note the substantial gains from 5000rpm to v-tec at 5600rpm. During the next dyno session, I will atempt to discern just how much of the gains from 5600rpm to 5900rpm are the changed v-tec engagement, and how much of it is the header doing its job.
Here is what it looks like if we break it down into seperate rpm ranges:
First off, power under 3400rpm is not measured
From 3400rpm to 4400rpm we see an approx. average increase of 3hp and 4ft/lbs
From 4500rpm to 5500rpm we see an approx. average increase of 4hp and 4ft/lbs
From 5600rpm to 5900 rpm we see peak gains of 20hp and 18ft/lbs however this is our "grey area" as according to HvRRZ most of this was due to lowering the v-tec point. I am inclined to slightly agree with HvRRZ however I know that not nearly ALL of the gains can be attributed to the crossover change. Dyno sheets will be up soon (1 week) to prove this.
From 6000rpm to 7500 rpm we see an approx. average increase of 5hp and 5ft/lbs
From 7600rpm to redline is where we started to lean it up a bit. During this range is where we see our peak hp gains of 7hp, however how much of it is attributed to the exhaust is up for debate (will try and get concrete data to support this)
Peak torque occurs at 6300rpm with an increase of 4.5ft/lbs up from 137.6 to 142.1. Note that peak torque occurs under stock ECU tuning with no V-AFC interferrence.
On the whole, this header+exhaust combo show excellent gains everywhere! We have no power loss at any point. We have consistent hp gains throughout the rpm band as well as consistent tq gains. I have yet to see a product which could even touch this.
The kicker is that this prototype was built out of MILD STEEL, and with NO heat shield! Anybody who knows there metal knows that mild steel conducts heat up to 220 times better than stainless. In other words, with the current prototype under hood temps are HUGE! When the final version is built out of stainless it will have exponentially better heat retention thus keeping EGT's higher, and hp up!
Here is what it looks like if we break it down into seperate rpm ranges:
First off, power under 3400rpm is not measured
From 3400rpm to 4400rpm we see an approx. average increase of 3hp and 4ft/lbs
From 4500rpm to 5500rpm we see an approx. average increase of 4hp and 4ft/lbs
From 5600rpm to 5900 rpm we see peak gains of 20hp and 18ft/lbs however this is our "grey area" as according to HvRRZ most of this was due to lowering the v-tec point. I am inclined to slightly agree with HvRRZ however I know that not nearly ALL of the gains can be attributed to the crossover change. Dyno sheets will be up soon (1 week) to prove this.
From 6000rpm to 7500 rpm we see an approx. average increase of 5hp and 5ft/lbs
From 7600rpm to redline is where we started to lean it up a bit. During this range is where we see our peak hp gains of 7hp, however how much of it is attributed to the exhaust is up for debate (will try and get concrete data to support this)
Peak torque occurs at 6300rpm with an increase of 4.5ft/lbs up from 137.6 to 142.1. Note that peak torque occurs under stock ECU tuning with no V-AFC interferrence.
On the whole, this header+exhaust combo show excellent gains everywhere! We have no power loss at any point. We have consistent hp gains throughout the rpm band as well as consistent tq gains. I have yet to see a product which could even touch this.
The kicker is that this prototype was built out of MILD STEEL, and with NO heat shield! Anybody who knows there metal knows that mild steel conducts heat up to 220 times better than stainless. In other words, with the current prototype under hood temps are HUGE! When the final version is built out of stainless it will have exponentially better heat retention thus keeping EGT's higher, and hp up!
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Originally Posted by ack5252,Oct 19 2006, 01:34 PM
HvRRZ, you are correct on the fact that a PART of those gains are from the lower v-tec engagement however, note the substantial gains from 5000rpm to v-tec at 5600rpm. During the next dyno session, I will atempt to discern just how much of the gains from 5600rpm to 5900rpm are the changed v-tec engagement, and how much of it is the header doing its job.
Here is what it looks like if we break it down into seperate rpm ranges:
First off, power under 3400rpm is not measured
From 3400rpm to 4400rpm we see an approx. average increase of 3hp and 4ft/lbs
From 4500rpm to 5500rpm we see an approx. average increase of 4hp and 4ft/lbs
From 5600rpm to 5900 rpm we see peak gains of 20hp and 18ft/lbs however this is our "grey area" as according to HvRRZ most of this was due to lowering the v-tec point. I am inclined to slightly agree with HvRRZ however I know that not nearly ALL of the gains can be attributed to the crossover change. Dyno sheets will be up soon (1 week) to prove this.
From 6000rpm to 7500 rpm we see an approx. average increase of 5hp and 5ft/lbs
From 7600rpm to redline is where we started to lean it up a bit. During this range is where we see our peak hp gains of 7hp, however how much of it is attributed to the exhaust is up for debate (will try and get concrete data to support this)
Peak torque occurs at 6300rpm with an increase of 4.5ft/lbs up from 137.6 to 142.1. Note that peak torque occurs under stock ECU tuning with no V-AFC interferrence.
On the whole, this header+exhaust combo show excellent gains everywhere! We have no power loss at any point. We have consistent hp gains throughout the rpm band as well as consistent tq gains. I have yet to see a product which could even touch this.
The kicker is that this prototype was built out of MILD STEEL, and with NO heat shield! Anybody who knows there metal knows that mild steel conducts heat up to 220 times better than stainless. In other words, with the current prototype under hood temps are HUGE! When the final version is built out of stainless it will have exponentially better heat retention thus keeping EGT's higher, and hp up!
Here is what it looks like if we break it down into seperate rpm ranges:
First off, power under 3400rpm is not measured
From 3400rpm to 4400rpm we see an approx. average increase of 3hp and 4ft/lbs
From 4500rpm to 5500rpm we see an approx. average increase of 4hp and 4ft/lbs
From 5600rpm to 5900 rpm we see peak gains of 20hp and 18ft/lbs however this is our "grey area" as according to HvRRZ most of this was due to lowering the v-tec point. I am inclined to slightly agree with HvRRZ however I know that not nearly ALL of the gains can be attributed to the crossover change. Dyno sheets will be up soon (1 week) to prove this.
From 6000rpm to 7500 rpm we see an approx. average increase of 5hp and 5ft/lbs
From 7600rpm to redline is where we started to lean it up a bit. During this range is where we see our peak hp gains of 7hp, however how much of it is attributed to the exhaust is up for debate (will try and get concrete data to support this)
Peak torque occurs at 6300rpm with an increase of 4.5ft/lbs up from 137.6 to 142.1. Note that peak torque occurs under stock ECU tuning with no V-AFC interferrence.
On the whole, this header+exhaust combo show excellent gains everywhere! We have no power loss at any point. We have consistent hp gains throughout the rpm band as well as consistent tq gains. I have yet to see a product which could even touch this.
The kicker is that this prototype was built out of MILD STEEL, and with NO heat shield! Anybody who knows there metal knows that mild steel conducts heat up to 220 times better than stainless. In other words, with the current prototype under hood temps are HUGE! When the final version is built out of stainless it will have exponentially better heat retention thus keeping EGT's higher, and hp up!
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Originally Posted by 2QYK4U,Oct 19 2006, 05:37 AM
So, if this guy saying that the cams alone should make an additional 40rwhp, or is that in combination with ITBs?
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The final product will be available in approx. 4 weeks. We will do final testing on VersionJDM's car in 2 weeks time. After final testing goes down I can give you a very accurate ETA. The exhaust is a custom design as well utilizing 2.5in tubing, no cat, and a magnaflow muffler.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
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From: formerly versionJDM
Originally Posted by ack5252,Oct 19 2006, 03:18 PM
The final product will be available in approx. 4 weeks. We will do final testing on VersionJDM's car in 2 weeks time. After final testing goes down I can give you a very accurate ETA. The exhaust is a custom design as well utilizing 2.5in tubing, no cat, and a magnaflow muffler.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
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Originally Posted by 2QYK4U,Oct 19 2006, 02:20 PM
If that is the case then it is nothing to write home about.
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Originally Posted by ack5252,Oct 19 2006, 02:18 PM
The final product will be available in approx. 4 weeks. We will do final testing on VersionJDM's car in 2 weeks time. After final testing goes down I can give you a very accurate ETA. The exhaust is a custom design as well utilizing 2.5in tubing, no cat, and a magnaflow muffler.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
I STRESS that there are adjustments that will be made to the prototype that will significantly help peak hp #'s as well as broadening the powerband. In addition, as I stated before the final STAINLESS product will significantly increase EGT's and hopefully hp.
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The current model which is what the dyno sheets represent has the following measurements:
1.75in primaries
2in secondaries
2.5in final collector
Lengths are proprietary information at this point as I know that there are a few other guys out there also developing headers at this time. After final testing of the production model, I will release more info.
In the end it doesnt matter unless you are a fabricator trying to copy it. Simply put, if it makes good power it makes good power, and if it doesnt then it doesnt.
1.75in primaries
2in secondaries
2.5in final collector
Lengths are proprietary information at this point as I know that there are a few other guys out there also developing headers at this time. After final testing of the production model, I will release more info.
In the end it doesnt matter unless you are a fabricator trying to copy it. Simply put, if it makes good power it makes good power, and if it doesnt then it doesnt.