JDM Tuning Expert advice and discussion on JDM tuning for your S2000.

the Official "NA Tuning" thread

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Old Nov 26, 2006 | 09:24 AM
  #2571  
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^^^The EMS does make the car a little more finicky to drive daily...ITB's take the car to a whole new level of finicky, picky, touchyness.

I've also been thinking about doing the exhaust last. Even though I hit a brick wall for peak hp at 8000 rpm, I'm thinking that that was more due to the age and abuse on my engine rather than exhaust bottlenecking. If and when I'm allowed to mess with anything again, I'm going to have 2nrwerks do a ring job, and a new set of valves as well, along with a refreshed valvetrain, and a spoon head gasket. After that, it'll be crower stage 2 cams.

BTW, I fixed my coolant leak. Turns out the heater hose from the water pump to the water neck got a small hole in it just above the water pump. What a bitch to replace. On a positive note, I can pull the belt, tensioner, and altenator out of the car now in less than 5 minutes
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:05 AM
  #2572  
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churchs dyno are always good for a laugh. why does he have them cali'd so insane. i wonder what i'd put down on that dyno? 270-280RWHP?!?! i know shawn is a great tuner, but from what i've seen on dynos (dynojets) the 06's have shown to be the strongest S2's yet. i've seen three of em put 215 to the wheel bone stock on a dynojet.
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:21 AM
  #2573  
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Originally Posted by versionJDM,Nov 26 2006, 11:05 AM
churchs dyno are always good for a laugh. why does he have them cali'd so insane. i wonder what i'd put down on that dyno? 270-280RWHP?!?! i know shawn is a great tuner, but from what i've seen on dynos (dynojets) the 06's have shown to be the strongest S2's yet. i've seen three of em put 215 to the wheel bone stock on a dynojet.
I thought I've already ended the debate as to how high his dynapack actually reads? I've posted many times that it reads 9% higher than AutoWave's dyno dynamics dynomameter, which reads 1-2% lower than a typical dynojet. Therefore, his dynapack reads 7-8% higher than a typical dynojet. I wouldn't call that significant.
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:28 AM
  #2574  
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^^so why not just re-cal it to read normally?
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:34 AM
  #2575  
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Originally Posted by versionJDM,Nov 26 2006, 11:28 AM
^^so why not just re-cal it to read normally?
To read normally? A dynapack will always read higher than a dynojet, it is just a matter of how much higher. Here is a great article Shawn wrote that you all should read: http://home.earthlink.net/~spchurch/church...sting/id12.html
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:41 AM
  #2576  
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good article thanks!
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:52 AM
  #2577  
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The measurement of horsepower on any dyno is exactly the same. The difference in output is due to the reduced drivetrain loss on a dynapack. On a dynapack, you remove you rear wheels and bolt the dyno directly to the rear hubs. The reduced drivetrain loss is what provides the added punch. Look at it this way...it shows you how much hp you'd be putting to the ground before you attached your heavy ass wheels. throw a set of spoon wheels on before a dyno, and you'd sit somewhere about 1/2 between a dynojet on stock wheels vs a dynapack.

Mustangs read lower because their rollers are smaller...the resistance applied by the computer is calculated slightly different between manufacturers, but if you put them all next to each other, it's going to boil down to roller dimensions as the deciding factor of why they're different. Dynapacks have no rollers, so obviously they operate differently.

If you really wanted to know exactly how much rear WHEEL hp a car is making using a dynapack's numbers, take the given horsepower shown at a given rpm, convert that to speed, take the derivative to get your current acceleration, then apply conservation of momentum to the mass of the wheel, to find out how much energy it takes to accelerate that mass wheel at that specific speed. Convert to horsepower, and subtract from your dynapack number.
Yes, that will be way to much friggin work for any of us to really care about. You could take a small number of samples, say every 1000 rpm, and do the calculation, and see what the % difference is...I doubt its linear, as our acceleration is not linear. the 7-8% generalization might only apply at peak.

...I know, I know. I can't help it. Finals are comming up, thus my brain is working in overtime.
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:57 AM
  #2578  
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Originally Posted by wildcardtrd,Nov 26 2006, 11:52 AM
The measurement of horsepower on any dyno is exactly the same. The difference in output is due to the reduced drivetrain loss on a dynapack. On a dynapack, you remove you rear wheels and bolt the dyno directly to the rear hubs. The reduced drivetrain loss is what provides the added punch. Look at it this way...it shows you how much hp you'd be putting to the ground before you attached your heavy ass wheels. throw a set of spoon wheels on before a dyno, and you'd sit somewhere about 1/2 between a dynojet on stock wheels vs a dynapack.

Mustangs read lower because their rollers are smaller...the resistance applied by the computer is calculated slightly different between manufacturers, but if you put them all next to each other, it's going to boil down to roller dimensions as the deciding factor of why they're different. Dynapacks have no rollers, so obviously they operate differently.

If you really wanted to know exactly how much rear WHEEL hp a car is making using a dynapack's numbers, take the given horsepower shown at a given rpm, convert that to speed, take the derivative to get your current acceleration, then apply conservation of momentum to the mass of the wheel, to find out how much energy it takes to accelerate that mass wheel at that specific speed. Convert to horsepower, and subtract from your dynapack number.
Yes, that will be way to much friggin work for any of us to really care about. You could take a small number of samples, say every 1000 rpm, and do the calculation, and see what the % difference is...I doubt its linear, as our acceleration is not linear. the 7-8% generalization might only apply at peak.

...I know, I know. I can't help it. Finals are comming up, thus my brain is working in overtime.
You are pretty much dead-on. If you read the article I posted above you'd pretty much see that Shawn is stating the same thing. On Shawn's dynapack, he uses a "TCF" of 1.0, which helps take into account wheel mass (for a pre-determined wheel size/weight).
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 10:59 AM
  #2579  
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^^^I need to read articles before I respond. I could have saved myself alot of wasted typing
Old Nov 26, 2006 | 11:17 AM
  #2580  
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wow, i wonder if i'd of hit 230 without my 22lbs per wheel ASA AR1's? i know their heavy, but their still within one pound of LMs. i bet i might have hit 13.4 with some stockers on too. hmmmmm.....



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